Why Tokenize? Fidelity on Onchain Assets and the Next Phase of Adoption

Transcript

We like to think about our product roadmap and really the strategy for how we continue to build this business through the lens of what does the pathway to the adoption of digital markets look like. The next phase of adoption we see as being able to use these assets on chain making these tokenized assets useful to investors. >> What is the advantage of doing that? >> That is actually the most important question that I think anybody who is looking at tokenization has to start with. Why are you bringing that asset on chain? What does it get to do on chain that it can't do today? Who are you doing it for? And how is that person going to be able to use that asset on chain?

>> Cynthia, thanks so much for being here. >> Thank you so much for having me. This is a great location and and fantastic weather. >> We're glad you could make it. So, you're in charge of digital asset management at Fidelity. Tell us what are you responsible for? What are you doing? what is going on inside of Fidelity when it comes to bridging trad >> the division um that I'm in uh sits within our asset management business at Fidelity. This unit was really dedicated and stood up within asset management only a few years ago with the intention that from an asset manager's lens um understanding not just how to think about crypto assets as a new investable asset class um but also what does this

technology and and the evolution of our capital markets being driven by this technology mean for an asset manager. And so, um, also from my team's, um, lens, looking at, um, building new applications and, um, looking at new ways to be able to allocate capital onchain and also thinking about the flow of capital between traditional markets and onchain markets. And this is where tokenization and tokenized fund rappers becomes very interesting as we think about the evolution of asset management.

you oversaw the launch of one of the Bitcoin ETP products and also you have tokenized a money market fund. So yeah, what what's going on? What kind of products are you launching? What's cooking over there? What can we expect in the future from your efforts? >> We like to think about our product roadmap and and really the strategy for how we continue to build this business through the lens of um what does the pathway to the adoption of digital markets look like? And so we started with the premise of how do we help our clients to be able to get exposure uh to this asset class and that would be under the hold phase um of adoption. So how do we help investors to get access to trade these assets and and hold them in their portfolios and this is where the ETPs um

have been a fantastic way to introduce traditional investors to these onchain assets. The next phase of adoption we see as being able to use these assets onchain. And where tokenizing assets is really not the hardest part of bringing assets on chain, it's making these tokenized assets useful to investors and useful to investors in ways that are different from the way in which they can think of these assets in their brokerage accounts today. And from our standpoint, that means making these assets mobile um onchain, allowing investors to use them to deposit as collateral to be able to get access to capital on chain or to be able to use these assets um and make

them more easily tradable into a more highly customizable portfolio. And then another use case that uh we are seeing a lot more adoption on is the ability to generate yield onchain. And this native yield onchain through staking is incredibly differentiated from traditional sources of yield. And being able to package that yield into a traditional uh wrapper such as ETP makes it very easily deliverable to a traditional investor and another introduction into the utility of assets and of these onchain markets. The third phase of adoption is what we've been calling the build phase. And this is where you have onchain assets in an onchain wrapper and the ability to be

able to deliver hyperpersonalized exposures to investors with these both tokenized traditional assets as well as native onchain assets and then being able to construct portfolios on chain. >> You're talking about bringing assets on chain. Yeah. >> What is the advantage of doing that? What do you get from tokenizing an asset? And also, are there stages of becoming onchain? Like, are you onchain or off-chain? Or is there some kind of gradation, a spectrum toward becoming fully onchain? >> That is actually the the most important question that I think anybody who is um looking at tokenization has to start with, which is the question of um you know, why are you bringing that asset on chain? What does it you know, get to do on chain that it can't do today in its

current form? And who are you doing it for? and and how is that person going to be able to use that asset on chain? And so as we think about, you know, what what does this mean in terms of the progression of, you know, where we see markets going today? We have onchain assets in an off-chain wrapper, which is the ETP and and that is using existing infrastructure for distribution uh to be able to deliver onchain exposures. The onchain infrastructure for distribution is really at at the very beginning right now. We see this with uh our tokenized money market fund that we launched earlier this year. You know, as we've talked about quite a bit in and our team, we've spent um you know, a good portion of time building out the

infrastructure to be able to support the issuance of the token. I think we've probably spent more time building out both the relationships as well as some of the uh ecosystem um development that we need to build in order to make this token more usable on chain. >> So, you mentioned uh building out relationships with people. I'd imagine you meet with lots of people. How do you sus out what's real? Who's real? >> Yeah. >> Who's got the goods, who doesn't? What is that process like for you? >> That's, you know, starts with the premise of, you know, not only, you know, what are you building or or what is um the project about, but what's the vision for for where that um you know, project fits in in the bigger picture ecosystem. and the founders that you

know we've worked with over the um you know last few years as as we've been ourselves um building out our thesis for what this looks like for our products and and for bringing more of our customers into the ecosystem to get exposure um both to assets on chain as as well as to be able to get access to capital on chain which is what we're working toward. How do we um think about what this you know additional piece of infrastructure or or this platform? How do we um work with that platform? A lot of, you know, what we found in in some of our early conversations with onchain lending protocols and and, you know, the so-called DeFi projects is that there are quite a few of them that are very very progressive in in understanding how

to engage with institutions and and understanding, you know, how to work with us to be able to evolve or build the technology that we need in order to incorporate AML and KYC and uh to be able to open up the platform for more regulated ated products um to be able to be traded. >> We recently put out a state of crypto report which is this big data inensive report about the crypto industry. One of the slides that we had is on real world asset tokenization. You know it was kind of shocking to me to see that there's now $30 billion worth of assets on chain. A lot of that is US debt treasuries. I'd say like half is that half is private credit. Yeah. But it's stunning because over the past few years

it went from basically being nothing on chain to now being $30 billion which some might say maybe that's still a small number but it's extremely rapid growth. >> Yeah. >> And so my question is why now? What's happening that is making this the moment where all of this is now finally taking place >> in terms of you know where we are seeing a lot of that immediate growth that that you just highlighted in tokenized treasury products and and the so-called tokenized money market funds post the small and regional bank mini crisis that that happened a couple of years ago with the the deep pegging of of a you know very large um well-known stable coin >> USDC >> yes there I think there was a recognition from a market standpoint point that the banking system uh needed

to be looked at uh from the standpoint of not just uh access which is I think where a a lot of the early thesis was was focused but also on you know the flow of of capital and and the payment system. That was I think where uh there was an aha moment for the use of tokenized money market funds um as a way to be able to bridge that payments and yield gap that today in you know brokerage platforms for example there is cash in brokerage platforms that cash is typically swept into interestbearing um products. So the idea that any payments platform would hold cash and and not, you know, be able to get access to interest doesn't really resonate with most investors and users. with that

first event and then of course the Genius Act really just absolutely opened up uh the the marketplace for non-bank issuers to really think about um you know how do we facilitate payments more easily on our um platforms and where tokenized money funds um play a very important role for the reserve assets and being able to stay on chain for stable coin issuers uh and uh their underlying users. When you talk about giving yield on these money market funds, this really goes back to the roots of the company. I believe Ned Johnson like one of his big claims to fame was the cash management account.

Yeah. That he really popularized and enabled people to basically have this sort of hybrid banking accounts but also money market fund you could gain interest on and that was just like such a hot product for the company. >> And the other uh innovative feature was the ability to write checks off of your money market fund. >> Yes. Yeah. That was the huge selling point >> was massive. And so this is again where in the non-bank sector, we can create um regulated products that allow for investors on our brokerage platform to manage that short-term cash um and not have to uh transfer that cash between multiple accounts in order to do everyday things that they need to do with their financial assets. So whether that is the short-term liquidity of paying bills, whether that is being able

to take those assets and um invest them for the longer term or if you decide that you want to save uh for a short-term event or or short-term um need that, you know, we provide that range of um investment assets to allow for investors to do that. >> And it's really amazing how Fidelity has been keeping up with the times. I mean, even a decade ago before a lot of people were thinking about crypto, a lot of companies were thinking about it, your firm was mining Bitcoin. I remember Abby Johnson talking about this back when I was a reporter covering the industry, you know, that long ago.

>> I think that goes to the core of what Abby has talked about quite a few times and and I think she said uh earlier today that this kaizen really refers back to this constant and and continuous improvement in yourself and and in your business. And you know this idea of you know mining Bitcoin wasn't just suddenly somebody waking up one morning and saying hey I should you know mine Bitcoin but rather it started with this curiosity and and saying I just heard about this new thing called Bitcoin. I'm not quite sure whether it's a thing whether it's not a thing but I should make it my job to figure out whether or not it is something and so how do I go about doing that? You have to deconstruct something. Um, I think oftentimes in order to figure out how to

put it back together again to really truly understand how it works and and then you start to think about what are the possibilities for what happens to our marketplace and and to our, you know, monetary system if there is such a thing as Bitcoin. >> As we start thinking about this this new industry that's arisen, the onchain economy, how do you decide when is right to buy versus build or partner? >> What goes into that decision-making process? >> It's a hard question. Um and and I think if you start from the philosophy of you've got to evaluate your operating platform uh in the context of what it is that you're looking to build and and you know what are the most important points of um differentiation uh for your product to your client what are the

touch points that you will have with your client. And I think those elements of the operating platform that give us the most control to be able to pivot and and to be flexible in in being able to build new functions to really differentiate our product offering. Those would be the the parts of our operating platform that we would tend to want to build. There are going to be times when time to market is is really also going to drive that partner versus build equation and that's uh going to be part of u the the decision- making as well. After you meet with a startup, what is the postgame analysis like? Like what do what do you talk about? How do you decide how a meeting went?

>> Oftentimes, I think it's just sort of the the human nature of of the interaction is did we find a connection with the founders's vision and and how they go about articulating it, but also putting that all together and and do they have a good understanding of the regulatory environment um that we are looking to operate within? but also how do we think about those principles as we apply them in this new market environment and and so it's that ability to help us think outside of the traditional lines of you know where we have um traditionally operated.

>> Amazing. I want to hit you with a few very quick lightning round questions if you have a moment. >> Yeah, sure. >> Okay. What's your biggest productivity hack? very very quickly um skimming through whether it's um Apple News I'm a big reader of because it has gotten to know what I'm uh most interested in gives me the headlines and and I can just quickly scroll through that and that's a really good way for me to get a quick download of not just business news but sports news and and entertainment news. >> I do something very similar. >> Yeah. >> What is the worst career advice you've ever gotten?

>> Advice around defaulting to what's comfortable. it oftentimes ends up being uh the opposite of the you know really good career advice which is be open to to doing all variety of things even the things that you wouldn't have ever thought um that you would be doing you I started out at Fidelity as the head of um legal for asset management and then very quickly before I realized it um I was way down the rabbit hole in cryptos today I am no longer in legal um and and I'm now leading being one of the most exciting um divisions in Fidelity and and couldn't have been, you know, more excited and and happy to be doing this.

>> That's great. Okay, two more quick ones. One is show a film, >> The Amazing Race. I don't know why this just resonates with me and maybe because I just happen to have seen it. I've been watching this for for many many years and there's something about putting two people in a situation how they work out the the adversities and the oh my gosh I would never imagine doing this or oh boy this is a really awful fear and I have to come. So it's one of these reality shows that that gives you that human condition in ways that just so resonate with with a few different audience types.

>> That's a great recommendation. Last question. Yeah. >> What is the smallest hill that you will die on? authenticity and and you know honesty and that's a hill all day long that that um I will um advocate for do the things that that speak to you be honest be direct even when delivering you know tough news and and I found that it's the best way to be able to you know continue that that connection and it resonates with people the the honesty and the authenticity >> that's great Cynthia [music] thank you so much for joining