Robinhood vs. Coinbase and Three Stories from the Week

Transcript

All right, everybody. Welcome back to the Fully Vested podcast. I'm your host DfY Dave here with Patrick Scott. This is the Fully Vested podcast brought to you by DfY Lama. And today we're doing something new. We're doing something different because today is the first episode of Cliff Notes. And on Cliff Notes, we're actually going to pick each of us is going to pick three topics from the week that we found interesting that our curiosity led us to. And we're going to see where we match. We have not shared our three picks of the week. So this should be interesting live reaction. And then we're going to talk about it. We're just going to talk about it, have a conversation, you know, see where we agree, disagree. And yeah, this is the first episode trial run. Thank you for

joining us. Patrick, how are you feeling about Cliff Notes? >> I'm feeling good. I'll say this up front. I will be shocked if any of ours match cuz I try to go for like the three biggest stories of the week. I just went for three things that I found interesting. If anything, tried to go for things that were um you know, I thought people might not have heard of before. That I thought would be interesting to them. So I'll I'll be shocked if any of ours overlap. If they do, that's great. Um But I yeah, we're trying new things.

>> With yeah, with mine, I was I followed my natural curiosity first and foremost. That's what I always do. I tried to go at different levels. And I think one might be a surprise. I think one is might be a you know, out of out of left field. >> Yeah, I'm going to be also real up front. Not all mine have to do with DfY. They mostly have to do with They mostly have to do with markets, but not all mine have to do with DfY. >> I think we might have a commonality. Uh uh uh >> Okay, well, let's see. Okay, so do you want to kick it off with your three and then >> Yes. Okay.

I'm going to kick it off with my three. So the three the three that I have, first I have stock tokens. specifically the battle that we're seeing between Base and Robinhood um that's going on. >> Okay. >> Uh two, you have one of the same ones. >> [laughter] >> Wait, wait. That's one a right [laughter] away right away. There's one of the same ones. All right. Okay, two is net net uh cuz they're taking in stock tokens in their NAV. So, I find that in their treasury, I mean. So, I find that interesting. Uh and then the third one, I have Jackson Hole.

Uh you know, I have Yeah. Yeah, I I have uh you know, what they said about stable coins and tokenization as well uh as Kevin Warsh's recent comments >> Oh, you mean like like like like the meeting there. I thought you meant >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Like just like like the Jackson Hole as a vacation spot. I was going to say, "Oh yeah. >> No. Oh, wow. You're going like real broad. Yeah, I didn't realize you could do that. No, I meant the Jackson Hole conference, Fed Con. >> I mean, that's that makes a lot more sense. I was going to say, you know, there's vacation spots I can recommend to. Um All right, that's that's cool. So, I I'm going to share my screen for mine.

So, I'll show uh show some of my uh X. All right, so. First, I had >> Wow, the first one. The first one. >> This the first one. So, I so I guess I was wrong. I shouldn't have been that surprised that we had similar one. >> The first one. >> was focused on was the stats. And what what what I thought was crazy was that in terms of activity, Robinhood chain is actually completely mogging Base recently. >> Yeah. >> Like I knew that it was doing well. I didn't realize it how much it was mogging it.

>> Well, I actually uh what I like when I was doing my research into it, I was not looking into the stats. I was looking into the structure. I didn't realize the differences between Coinbase like the Base stock tokens and the Robinhood stock tokens. So, the Base stock tokens, there's only four of them. There's the video, meta, Apple, and Google. and their actual one-to-one shares of the stock as tokens. It's not a derivative, it's not an IOU, it's actually, you know, a one-to-one position. It's actually like you're you are holding the stock. Uh the Robinhood stock tokens are tokenized debt securities. So, they're more exposure.

Uh and although you're not holding it like one-to-one, uh Robinhood has been able to issue 90 stocks. Um so, I think that's really interesting the design choices that both Base and Robinhood made and also the history of both companies. Base coming from crypto natively and Robinhood coming from equities and stocks. >> That is really interesting. I I agree. I think Yeah, so it's interesting we came at it from like different angles, but we had sort of a similar topic there. >> Yeah. >> And it's funny >> Yeah, go Yeah, go ahead.

>> Oh. >> Oh. >> So, what I was going to say is funny that the crypto platform came out with the one-to-one conversion of the stock, while the, you know, the equity native platform came out with just the exposure. Uh interesting design I guess that's like an odd like a nod on the stablecoin on to stablecoins because stablecoins should be redeemable. >> Yeah, I mean, I would say stablecoins are like are like the biggest like people don't think of stablecoins as RWAs, but like they basically are, right? They're They're >> They're the They're the biggest RWAs by far. >> Yeah.

Yeah. >> Um all right, so I'll go through my other ones. Let's see. >> Okay. >> So, we've got uh this one. So, yes, I am sharing my own tweet as most interesting things. >> [laughter] >> Uh this this guy, Eric, uh I guess it's Eric Ol Olszewski. Not sure if I'm getting that right. He started this startup, which is the first startup, maybe the first private company in history to enrich uranium. So, the nuclear market and uranium market are heating up. There's a lot of crypto people into it. Um these these guys literally literally enrich uranium with their startup.

What's interesting is a lot of people don't realize that. I went to his LinkedIn and he actually had started a couple of crypto companies previously. And the interesting thing is he's not the first crypto founder I've seen this week who successfully launched like a deep tech or hard tech startup. There was this other company that I think they were they were in YC or something and they basically spent their entire uh YC batch time in Ukraine building some kind of drone system. And I went and looked at the founders' backgrounds and like several of them like previously working on this crypto startup. So, I think it's interesting that like you actually have this trend now of crypto founders not just pivoting to hard tech

but actually doing it extremely successfully. >> Yeah, I'm always proud when crypto crypto-native founders go on to new industries. It's kind of like our alumni spreading their wings. Uh and >> Yeah, interesting. >> Yeah, yeah. Um >> Yeah, it's like your alumni spreading their wings but also part of me was like, you know, does that validate criticisms of the industry that it's a misallocation of talent? Like you have people optimizing yield curves who could be like revolutionizing, you know, the energy industry instead. >> You know, I think people are either following their natural curiosity like we are here or you know, they're following the money. And the people that follow the money, they just you know, follow the hottest trend. But I wouldn't say uranium uranium's a very specific

thing. It's not like I don't see like uranium spoken in the same way as like AI and robotics. Uh right now. >> True. Well, nuclear though, nuclear. >> Nuclear Oh, nuclear. Yeah. >> stick. Nuclear could be >> Well, you're you're big into uranium. You have the uranium >> big into uranium. I I built I built a uranium website. So, here's actually something interesting related to that. I built this uranium website. It's up to like a few hundred visitors a day now, pretty consistently. Just like analytics on it. But I heard from someone cuz I got feedback from some people in the mining industry. They said, "Oh, yeah, there's been like a few of these niche data sites they've seen pop up recently." And they said they're almost all founded by people from the crypto industry. So, I feel like that's kind of interesting that probably because we're

used to these like hyper-modern, like very user-friendly dashboards. And like And also cuz I think probably a disproportionate percentage of young people who are investing are doing it in crypto markets. Now as people like branch out to other things, they're bringing that same expectation. And so, I thought it was interesting that like this person noticed that it was a lot of people from the crypto industry. Like and and the one they they shared with me was um was like some kind of real estate dashboard, but it was like you could look at it and be like, "Okay, this like kind of feels like CoinGecko, but it's about like real estate markets." Um and it's interesting they seeing that.

>> I I saw a tweet weeks ago. I think it was from Joe Weisenthal. Or he retweeted or quote tweeted something where uh if you're able to make some public data legible and make a service out of it, there's a huge opportunity there business-wise. Like something that like no one care Like maybe like, you know, pay few like futures or like some very niche esoteric statistic that people do find valuable, but no one's ever made a dashboard for it. But now it's easier than ever to make a dashboard for it. >> I I saw someone did that with um with like water quality cuz I guess a lot of these a lot of these municipalities they they're required to like test water quality. And um and so, this person just went and

actually like went and requested all this data from them and then put it into a dashboard so you can go and look up the quality of of like of like your local uh tap water. Um all right. So, I've got another one. And before I get my do my last one, I've got a 2.5. I'm not going to count this one cuz this is uh not even related to markets at all. Uh um All right. All right. Okay, my thing was freezing. Here we go. So, uh It's ano- It's another one of my tweets. Um this is just mind-blowing me. I was playing around with the Google Ngram thing where you can look up the common of words. You're a you guys guy, right?

Like you're you're from the Northeast. You say you guys, not y'all. >> No, I say y'all. >> You say y'all? >> I I'm But I'm different like I'm different like that. I like I say you guys. I like I mean y'all you guys is two syllables, y'all is one. >> Y'all is one? I so I feel like y'all is Okay, I actually think yinz is probably the best one if you're looking at it like just just by pure merit, but they only say that in Pittsburgh. Use I've I remember that says use. It's not, you know, use use I don't know about use. Anyways, I didn't realize you guys had become like so much more popular in the past 20 or 30 years. Like it's basically become like a standard part of English.

Uh I I was just I was curious, so I looked this up on Google Ngram and I was like, "Damn, that's like crazy." So So basically for people um who don't know what Google Ngram is, it like tracks like usage of words within I guess books or publications. So basically you guys has gone from being like it's gone up like 10x in usage in the past 30 years. >> Mhm. >> Um but that doesn't count as my thing because, you know, this has nothing to do with >> I like we should include non-finance crypto-related things and things we find interesting. Okay, fine. I'm going to Yeah, I have one then. I have one and >> You've got one. You've got a bonus one, too. I I have I have one more, but go ahead yeah.

>> Oh, no, no. Okay, how about you go first and then we'll like Can we then discuss mine? We'll just go discuss all mine after. So you you finish your last one and then yeah. >> Okay, yeah, so last one is Got to give a shout-out to Defi Llama and our [clears throat] new universal token ranking dashboard, which has gotten a lot of mixed a lot of opinions both positive and negative, but you know, that's the goal. And And basically what's interesting about this is it's not a measure of things as like whether it's a good investment because like this has nothing to do with fundamentals.

Basically, it's a measure of quality the way you talk about like food quality where it's like is it made of what it says it's made out of and does it um you know, is it safe to eat? Like if you talk about food quality, it's like do the do the ingredient on this accurate and is it safe? So in this case, it goes through for example like you know, legal disclosures like tokenomics disclosures. >> Damn, Uniswap really improves. >> You know, Uniswap so so the thing with this again is like it's not necessarily saying it's a good investment. It's saying that like they have a very high score on like all of their disclosures. Like so it's like you can see all these things public as well as like their legal structures is um yeah, that their legal structure I think they have improved cuz remember there

was like a lot of ambiguity at one point. >> Yeah. I mean they had like the Dedavers Labs, but now they have >> Exactly, yeah. >> Yeah. >> And then there's the performance and performance here is um it's not saying performance in terms of like it does well. So I I think probably we could explain this better. This is saying like you know, is is liquidity deep? Is it like listed consistently across many exchanges? Those kinds of things. Um basically I mean you can think of some of these things might be less relevant on on the high level, but like on the margins when you talk about like tokens that are not widely distributed like it becomes really important. Okay, is this something that like actually has like like deep liquidity and like market makers where I'm not going to be wrong with where I buy it and then it

like drops 90% a few days later. Yeah, or a rug pull. Um anyways, got to got to give a shout out to this and it's um >> Yeah, I saw that. Very very cool product. I I see Cap is in there. Um so Cap made the 128. That's cool. Interesting. I'll I'll message more about the show about that too. But uh >> Yeah, well we can we we can get you set up with like claiming your profile and if there's anything that needs to be fixed, we can do that. >> Yeah. Cool. Cool. So, all right. I guess it's we we went through yours. Uh we'll go through my stuff that I mentioned. So, we'll do NetNet first. Have you seen NetNet on the timeline?

>> No, I haven't seen NetNet. >> You haven't? You haven't? Hold on. Let me Answer did like a big tweet about it. I don't know. He did like his like NetNet thesis. Yeah. >> NetNet NetNet Capital Management, is that this? >> Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Oh, it's Olympus style? It's Olympus style fork? >> Yeah, yeah. It's a Olympus DAO style uh fork that takes in not only, you know, stable coins, but also stock tokens in their treasury. It treats tokenized stocks as treasury assets. And it's the same, you know, like in the same way that Ohm was the floating asset, Net is the floating asset.

Um and right now it just supports, you know, Nvidia, SpaceX, and Apple. Um I don't I just find it really interesting that people got excited again about the in DeFi. I haven't seen people this excited about DeFi in like 5 years. Um and I just want to Yeah. >> What's the market cap of this right now? >> I don't know. It It [ __ ] ran up. It [ __ ] shot up. I think it's like it went It was like, I don't know, like under 100 bucks, and now it's like 1,000 bucks. I don't like talking about price on here. Nothing's financial advice.

>> Okay, yeah. Yeah, there's no financial advice. Uh >> But >> no financial advice, uh but math. Okay, this is This is intriguing, to say the least. >> Yeah. And this goes into um Hold on. Let me share my screen. Can we see my screen? I basically I just want to collect my my cloud where last month I said DeFi is coming back. I feel it in my bones. And then I made This was my prediction. You know, it doesn't His History doesn't repeat, it rhymes. And I basically you know, like the next DeFi summer or arb season is going to be around equities and commodities and everything in between. And look how it played out. And look how it played out. Net net is

exactly what I meant. Like people coming up with new primitives that are using things that were not available before. And since socks tokens are net new, people no pun intended, uh people are excited about them and experimenting and playing these games. And not only is net net uh well, this is like what I said to collect my clout. But anyways, um let me go back. >> I'll give you credit. Okay. I'm I'm I'm confused about one thing though. On the website, looks like there's games on there too. >> Yeah, they have. >> Like so not there I see blackjack. >> So not only is it uh you know, a ohm like an ohm fork with tokenized stocks in the treasury, but there's uh extra surface areas where they do have games.

And so the games are part of their product suite. >> Interesting. Would you might you say it might you say it's a metaverse? It's a it's an ohm fork that's a that's a metaverse play. >> [laughter] >> No one has called it a metaverse, but I guess if it was 2021, it would be a a metaverse play. >> I'm joking cuz remember that was always always the thing with like ohm forks where they were trying to differentiate themselves by like just building a house. >> No, I mean there was like >> but like basically the equivalent of flash games. >> Yeah. They Yeah, I guess you know. >> But you remember they had ohm forks that were like >> like climate ohm forks. I mean you had every flavor of ohm fork back in the day. Um yeah. But it's crazy though. It's just like a

>> This is cool. >> Yeah. You want to share your screen? >> Yeah, I'll share my screen so people can see what I'm talking about. Um let's see here. Now this is this is I haven't felt this way in years. This is reinvigorating. >> So yeah, so you got flight simulator, blackjack, um but then it's also I mean I think the real thing to focus on here is to to think about the treasury and the and the uh you know, the premium to NAV and all those types of things. >> [laughter] >> It's crazy right now. >> Yeah. And that is a that is actually a very interesting net in issue. That's they should distributions next distribution.

Okay, so you could they don't they don't have a Lambo calculator yet. I don't think. Remember that? >> No, I I think I think they've they've learned their lesson not to have a Lambo calculator. Okay, yeah, I think they learned their lesson, but net is new. I think it's cool. I am personally not in net net, but I'm happy for everyone who is um you know, I I don't >> but I might be by the time this airs to be honest. This is >> Yeah. >> And then I I can feel feel it in my I can feel like the old Patrick coming back.

>> The old Patrick. I remember watching that. >> who used to watch Zion Modified channel. Remember I used to do yield farm Friday where I would go through like like the most degenerate farms like I could find that people would send me every Friday. So I'm I can feel >> wonder I wonder who the team is behind it, you know, I wonder if >> Yeah, I was actually have the same question. I definitely won't put serious money into this to be honest, but >> Um a big deal. >> I don't know. Um >> The only problem is I always like do this stuff and then when tax time comes it like Wait.

That's viewed in Internet Explorer 5.5. That's weird. That says that on like the bottom of the thing. >> Yeah. >> Maybe it's because like it's made in this like old 1990s style. >> Yeah. It really you know, strikes a chord with the old D5 heads. Um but anyways >> It really does, yeah. >> Now I'm going to go a complete 180. >> Yeah, they're Sorry there. I'm going to say they're definitely trying to do some kind of like warp as like being like a 1990s company cuz it says like Y2K compliant on there.

>> No, yeah, they they have a the the UI style. It looks funny. Yeah, remember like the old Curve UI and like how it like no one really liked it. It's kind of like if I would compare like the NetNet UI and the old Curve UI in a meme, it's that human resources meme. It's like NetNet is like the meme of like the Chad guy going and saying like, "Yeah, hey Stacy." And like the girl like the woman is like, "Oh, hey." Um and then like there's another and then uh the Curve old Curve UI is like the other one and the person the woman's like, "Oh, hello human resources." I would like Yeah, I would like that's how I'd compare the two UIs cuz they're both like 90s, but like one is like it's different. Anyways, um I was going to go a complete 180 from

NetNet uh to Jackson Hole with the Fed conference that's going on there. Um Um can you still hear me? >> Yeah, I can hear you. >> Okay. Okay, got it. Yeah, I'm going to go complete 180 to the Jackson Hole conference that's going on. So, right now the Kevin Warsh and a bunch of people are there uh and they did talk about crypto and they talked about dollar-linked innovation. So, basically structurally, I would say Jackson Hole is treating stable coins and tokenizations as part of the monetary system now, which is pretty cool.

Uh and like that's the direction right now that seems like federal policy wants to go towards. Um you know, especially with like Genius Act live and now agencies have to meet these deadlines and stuff like that. And so, payment stable coins have their role, so that's cool to see. Uh like stable coins have had their day. Uh and I always said that you know, stable coins are really powerful tool in the US monetary docket. And I'm surprised it took this long for uh policy makers to realize this. Um but then another thing is uh I don't know if you heard So, this morning Kevin Warsh had some comments about inflation where he's like, "Guys, it's a bit too high.

If it doesn't get under control soon, we might have to do something about it." He didn't say that he was going to do hikes next month, but uh he did say something along the lines uh we have to like make sure that inflation is manageable going forward. So, you know, that always has consequences for, you know, not just crypto and DeFi, but all of finance. >> Yeah. No, that's those are those are that's very interesting. I I It's actually what you said about stablecoins being such an important tool. Um I'm sure people have seen this at this point, but like Tether would be one of If Tether were a country, it would be one of the largest countries by >> Mhm.

>> um US Treasury purchases. >> Yeah. >> So, like I guess it's actually and that's with, you know, basically with minimal we'll say like like support from the US government historically, right? Like stablecoins could actually be like a huge incremental buyers buyer of US debt, which would basically uh it would let the uh flywheel keep going much longer, right? It would let that >> Yeah. >> flywheel. Some might say a charade or whatever. Basically, it would let the whole system keep running. The flywheel Let the flywheel keep running running uh a lot longer if you have like they found a new source to buy trillions of dollars of US debt.

>> I mean, this is the opportunity to do it when USD stablecoins are still 99% of stablecoins. I'm not sure if it's going to be like that forever. It seems like it, but, you know, you never know uh what's going to happen. But, uh anyways, uh I have another one. Since you had one that isn't crypto-related, I have a point five one. I have a a bonus one. So, >> All right, let's see it. >> Today I learned, you know, this was a few days ago, uh Mexico City is at an elevation of 7,350 ft, which is over 2,000 ft higher than Denver.

Which is, you know, pretty substantial. Like, you know, they always say, "Oh, Denver's the Mile High City." No, it's uh that's that's uh Mexico City. Mexico City is the mile higher city. >> Literally, wow. Yeah, that is interesting. That is a very interesting fact. Have you noticed it being there? >> Um yes, I've noticed it in two ways. Sometimes when I like walk up the stairs too fast, and sometimes when I drink tequila too fast. Those are the two ways I've noticed. >> [laughter] >> Yeah. Yeah so >> Yeah, but yeah, I've been been here in Mexico City uh for a bit. It's a cool vibe. It's a cool vibe. I would describe Mexico City as it's bustling but not overwhelming.

Um you know, happy happy to you know, be here. >> You know, huge city, right? >> Yeah, it's a massive city, but the area that you can really like go out and walk in is smaller. It's not like you can go to like all different parts of the city. But even the area you can go in is like pretty cool. >> Oh, that's cool. >> Yeah. >> That is that is an interesting fact that it's that high. I I may actually wonder um you know, what what other cities might be a high elevation like I'm I'm sure there's some in the Andes and like >> Yeah.

>> Central and like Central Asia and stuff that are like shockingly high elevation. >> Do people have go all over the world? They settle everywhere from Alaska and you know, up there in Siberia and Greenland and whatnot to the deserts, to the mountains, to the beaches. But you know, >> You know, here's what I'd like to see. I'd like to see some billionaire I love space. I love space. But I'd love to see some billionaire really go against the grain and be like, "I'm going to set up a company for set exploring and building colonies in the sub-Antarctic islands and like Antarctic islands, maybe even Antarctica itself."

I think that would be really interesting. I know there's treaties against it. But but I think it'd be really cool, you know, it's like it's the last the great untamed white continent, you know, it's it's >> No, you're right. >> I I like it's it's a huge amount of land that's that's basically unclaimed. And there's no way there's not resources there, right? Like it's like how what would you do? Like there's no way there's not gold and maybe even oil probably like and other valuable resources somewhere in there. It's in the rest of the world. Why wouldn't it be in Antarctica?

>> Yeah. You know, maybe a Praxis should set up a network state there. >> I I honestly think I think they should. There's this one this one um island okay? I know this I'm I'm going way beyond my three. It's called Deception Island. >> Deception Island? >> You're not going to believe this is real okay? >> Okay. >> This is a real island. >> That looks like a menacing >> menacing. It looks it's it's it's like built to be someone's secret lair or headquarters. Like any I've seen a natural harbor like this.

And now now I guess there's volcanic activity, so there used to be some sort of headquarters there that I guess research station that was shut down. Um but apparently it's a tourist destination. Anyways, there's all these cool islands all around Antarctica. I think it'd be pretty sick if someone was like, all right, I'm going to try to make them economically productive. Arctic X, you could call it. Arctic X. Um All right? Like just think about it. >> That's a lot easier of a leap than space. Going to the >> Yeah, I I I actually think they would learn a lot of interesting things that would be useful for space. So I'm surprised no one's done it. Maybe it's because there's like so many treaties against it and those kinds of things.

>> But Patrick, I thought of a new business for you. >> I I You don't Believe me. Believe me, I've thought about this before. Uh Uh anyways, any final words from you for our first cliff notes fully vested cliff notes. >> No, I I like the style. I like, you know, it this is fun. Uh we had a lot of stuff in common. I liked how we came at things from different perspectives like in the beginning. Uh, we did have something in common. >> you would do this again? >> Yeah, yeah, 100%. I would do more CliffNotes. And we should do a live stream of it. That's >> Yeah, I think maybe we should. For people watching, please let us know if you like this, if you don't like it, if you'd like to see changes because because um

we're trying out new things and and and I think you may see more like this in the future. >> Yeah. You know, and also go ahead, like, share subscribe follow comment reply on whatever platform you're watching this on. And if you like data, if you like AI, if you like both of them together, go sign up for DeFi Lama Lama AI below with our subscription link. >> Yep, please do. That analysis I did with Robinhood versus Space was using Lama AI and rumor has it there's going to be a discount coming for Fully Invested Podcast fans, which will be noted in the description as well.

>> Yeah. Hell yeah, we love discounts. Anyways uh thanks everyone for watching and we'll see you at the next one. Peace. >> Peace.