Logos: a technology stack for cypherpunks

Transcript

should start. Um yeah, so before we start, uh please allow me to do a brief introduction to dep learning. Yeah. So hello guys, welcome to today's step learning sharing meetings and uh yeah we maintain an open source develop development tutorials on GitHub and we hope we could only give junior developers and executable and simply this blockchain dep learning road map but also present advanced developers with a platform for communication and cooperation and uh today is quite special as you know Um, this sharing is the last one before the Luna New Year and here I wish

you have a happy Luna New Year back home and gather with families and have a good time with them. Today we invite Guru um to share logos the sovereign stack. So uh let's welcome to Guru. Hey everyone, uh nice meeting you all again after a year. Uh we had a workshop last year about Codex which is one of the projects that got consolidated into logos and I'll be explaining about how we've consolidated Codex, Vaku and other other portfolio projects that we have at

uh if logos. Uh, and it's a lot more easier to understand logos this time, uh, because everything just has one name, no logos, and there's not multiple names like last time. Uh, but I'll go ahead and share my screen. I have a a presentation with uh a less number of slides. It's just a couple of slides, but I still think the presentation could be a great supporting material. uh but I'll be doing most of the parts hands-on and I'll be sharing a lot of links. We don't have much of hands on parts as in coding parts today uh but uh we'll be looking at the different resources

available. Uh so yeah getting started with logos we wanted to build a sovereigning tech stack for people to build truly decentralized apps without compromising on uh various uh parts of the application which make it centralized and we'll be looking at uh the possible parts which can uh become centralized in uh web three applications and also the state of applications that are being used right now. Uh so uh before we start let's look at a quick timeline on how uh the technology evolved into what it is today. Uh so everything started with cryptography. Uh

when cryptography was uh introduced people started finding different use cases and store of value was one of them. uh bitcoin is designed uh to be a store of value by using cryptography and uh this was the first use case uh which kind of introduced the word blockchain and after bitcoin uh and kind of understanding that uh cryptography can be used in store of value. uh Ethereum was introduced where it was not just store of value but also uh programmable uh in a way like you can deploy smart contracts that run on the blockchain and these smart contracts are uh

uncensorable and decentralized and people started using this to build uh decentralized applications that we use today and uh eventually the way we look at logos is as a continuation of the Ethereum values. Uh we believe that Ethereum has uh kind of uh devoted into something which it was not uh 10 years ago. Uh and the reason why I'm saying this is because uh the decentralized web was envisioned in three pillars which is storage, messaging and compute. And uh I even have a better picture to kind of visualize this. Uh you can find this on

Vitalik's blog post itself. It's called making Ethereum Cypher Punk again and when you go into this article uh you can scroll down to find this image. Uh which I also believe I shared in the last year's call and uh this is how Ethereum was originally envisioned to be. uh there was Ethereum for consensus which operates with deployed smart contracts and this swam which was uh targeted towards storage and whisper for dynamic communications. So all these three together formulated the Ethereum white paper. But uh over time um the community has kind of uh potted the whole

technology focusing on Ethereum and has kind of forgotten Swam and Whisper. Although Swam exists as IPFS and Whisper used to exist as WAKU uh which is quoted by Vitalik himself uh over here and IPFS has gained remarkable amount of traction but it is still centralized considering that the way to use IPFS is through pinning services and the way you also access apps in the Ethereum ecosystem is uh not as decentralized as it should be and I'll be talking more about it. But uh when you look at the picture here,

there's something called the D browser which was um essentially meant to be a decentralized browser and DAPs run within this D browser and uh in today's world the best D browser that you can think of is something like Brave. Uh but you don't have a truly decentralized browser yet. And with logos uh we are trying to cut down a lot of dependencies uh starting from uh apps depending on RPCs and cloud hosts uh which are operationally centralized. Uh I'm I'm sure if you've built an app on Ethereum, you probably have been using an RPC to talk to Ethereum. uh an RPC could be

something like Alchemy, Infura or uh there's a bunch of others that exist in the market and uh also the validator clusters uh in Ethereum are currently running in safe jurisdictions which means you can't run it in every other country in the world or you don't have a locationational independence to be able to run it in a place with uh regulatory pressures. So this just makes it concentrated to certain countries in the world. And there's also other centralized parts which include bridges, APIs and stable coins which run on exposed infrastructure not neutral at all. So yeah, this is a quick background

to what Ethereum was uh 10 years ago from the white paper and uh how it is right now. It's just the Ethereum consensus that is buzzing in today's uh blockchain side of things. But things like swarm and whisper have uh winded down into nothing. Uh so yeah that's the background and before we go further if you have any questions be please feel free to drop them on the chat. Uh I can always uh find them uh eventually so that I can answer them then and there.

Uh give me one sec. Perfect. I have my chat open on the side. Cool. So going ahead to the next uh slide. This is about the problem. Uh so the problem that Logos is trying to solve is that first generation blockchains achieve base layer decentralization. first generation blockchains in the sense ethereum has achieve achieved a base level decentralization but uh it failed to extend to users uh and uh the reason why we are saying this is because of the centralized choke points that I mentioned before like uh the existence of something like an RPC and this just

makes Ethereum decentralized but the way of talking or communicating with Ethereum is and still centralized and uh without in protocol privacy uh anything that rem revolves around uh decentralization or sovereignity becomes an illusion for developers. It's just uh it's just a excuse that we have in terms of UX. We think providing good UX requires uh a level of uh centralization which is not true and this is exactly what we're trying to solve at Logos.

And uh the biggest highlight of Logos and how we uh plan to change the paradigm of interacting with web three apps is getting rid of the browser. So when I say getting rid of the browser, uh I actually mean it because you can't uh essentially use logos based applications within the browser just like you use something like uh uh something like Ethereum. Let's say I want to look at a Ethereum block scanner. I can just go to Google, go to Ether Scan and I can pretty much see all the transactions here uh which is being fetched from an RPC. And this is how

Ethereum works. But then the reason why we say this is not the best approach is because you still use HTTPS for communicating with the RP RPCs and the RPCs are operationally centralized. uh which means that they have access to your data uh which can be sold to analytical and uh also regulatory companies. So governments can buy this data from uh from multiple sources like ether scan for example and uh that way you can simply sell metadata that you're generating which is happening right now and we wanted to get rid of the browser

not just for this part but for multiple parts uh that also include the centralization of the UI. I'm sure you know about the buy bet safe hack uh that happened last year and this was supposedly one of the biggest hacks in uh that the industry has faced in the recent times and the reason why this happened was because of a safe wallet multi-IG wallet uh which uh got compromised uh because of the UI that was hosted in a centralized platform and this simply happened because uh of operational or logistical

centralization. Uh the UI was hosted in a centralized server and uh this can go through DNS poisoning or u could be even any attack vector that simply forwards the domain. Uh but yeah uh we wanted to get rid of the browser because it's doted neutral infrastructure and focus more on local applications and desktop applications which means that with logos you will be having a torrent u styled UX. Uh it's just like how torrent works.

Torrent is a protocol and uh something like bit torrent is a client and uh when you build on top of logos you're building clients uh for the protocol which is uh logos over here and with torrent it's torrent u for an example there's uh bit torrent uh which is a popular torrent client and uh you can use their web application uh which connects to a light node mode uh and uh in terms of the bitter and classic that's a local first application. So uh right now with logos we are targeting the local first applications because they provide full state-of-the-art

decentralization but whereas web SDKs could be uh a part in the future where you can have a light node to connect to a full node and uh yeah this will be in the future it's not in the road map as of now but uh yeah that's about uh the browsers and its role in surveillance. and how logos kind of wants to take a different approach by getting rid of the browsers. And uh this is also framed in a way like we don't challenge another blockchain but we just challenge the whole industry for uh for the way they got us accustomed to use uh web 3. So uh

I'm sure there's going to be a there's going to be a very challenging uh problem in terms of adoption. Uh but people already use things like torrent which is practical nowadays. So uh that's kind of the same mindset that we have when we talk about uh getting rid of the browsers and uh the solution that we propose for this after getting rid of the browsers is uh three-fold. Uh we have a blockchain which is uh a layer one called the logos blockchain and we have a messaging layer called logos messaging which is previously known as vaku and uh we did a workshop on waku last year with

tap learning and vaku is uh just a rebranded version of whisper it has been there from the ethereum white paper for a long time it's completely open source and a lot of projects have been using Waku in the past which include uh wallet connect u which is pretty popular in terms of uh de uh user onboarding in decentralized applications and there's also other pro projects like rail gun that still use it today. uh rail gun uses Waku for uh their decentralized relaying system and there's also the graph protocol which was historically using Waku for uh decentralizing their

indexers. So there's multiple projects that uh have been using Waku for a long time and uh we just rebranded it into logos messaging to make it a bit more uh decentralized uh by letting people uh get rid of the browsers and have their own full notes uh running in their machine. And there's also logo storage which is a content address storage uh previously known as codeex. So all of the projects that we were working on previously are still around but they just have different names to it and they are uh inclined towards one goal which is uh to help defend your civil

liberties with logos. And finally, core is a modular plug-in based runtime for people to build apps on top of logos. Which means that if you're building a uh logo score powered desktop app, you simply integrate logo score into it. And logo score is going to be something like an SDK for you to uh build this app. Uh you can imagine this to be a workbench something like Docker or Steam where uh you run the logo score binary to be able to enable all of these functionalities which is the blockchain messaging and

storage instead of depending on a traditional RPC. So overall there is no RPC at all in this uh in this particular solution that we propose. again uh so logo score uh replaces three main things. The first one being fragmented tool chains and centralized infrastructure. So when you build on top of logo score you don't have to worry about uh having AWS or an RPC service under the hood. Uh RPCs depend on uh centralized platforms like AWS. So uh we are completely getting rid of it. uh

from the get start and you also uh don't have to worry about manual integrations. Uh when I say manual integrations uh previously we used to have different binaries for each of these components. Uh they were uh they were solutions uh or binaries for running your own blockchain node or running your own vaku node. Uh previously we call this nvaku. So you'll have to run the naku binary for being able to use waku. But in this case we just consolidate all of it together into one uh logo score. So all you have to done is to uh integrate logo score and this helps you get access to

all the APIs and SDKs that are a part of the logo score ecosystem. And uh we also have our own client implementation for logo score called logos app. And this leverages the logo score framework where uh users can discover communities and also uh run sovereign applications on top of logos without third party dependencies. Uh imagine this to be a replacement for the browsers which exactly is uh the D browser which was promised in the Ethereum white paper but uh was never uh delivered in the last couple of years. Uh although there have

been Ethereum uh focused browsers but most of them ended up using a RPC historically. So yeah, logos app uh intends to replace browser apps, centralized frontends that are hosted for example the bybit uh and safe hack is a example where a centralized front end was compromised and also manual integrations again. So uh imagine this to be a bit torrent of logo score. This is just a client implementation of logo score. There can be multiple clients. uh you can make your own client as well. So uh that's how we uh look at Logos app and the blockchain itself uh is

completely private from the get- go. uh it's default uh privacy by default and uh we don't uh see privacy as an add-on to an existing uh blockchain and that's exactly why this is a layer 1 and not a layer two and uh it's still inclined to the Ethereum values. Uh it's not something that opposes the Ethereum values. This is deeply rooted with the Ethereum values. uh and uh some of the highlights of the blockchain include a private proof of uh stake and a private block proposals for validators and this can run on minimal hardware requirements. Uh when I say minimal

hardware requirements uh we have a uh ambition of being able to run this in your own uh home node which could be a Raspberry Pi. uh and we are currently benchmarking uh the performance on a PI R4 and this is set to be public very soon. And uh another highlight is also about the integrated privacy zones with decentralized execution environments and uh synchronous composibility. We have various execution zones uh within logos and one of them is the logos execution zone LE and I'll be uh sharing links to it uh in the next few minutes. Uh but

yeah that's another highlight and privacy primitives are uh designed from ground up which means designed from uh the day one. uh we don't have any add-ons for privacy. Everything is private, completely private uh including the states uh from the get-go and we plan to replace traditional DA networks. Uh Ethereum has a data availability networks uh built on top of it. uh and we plan to bring it all in one place which is in the blockchain layer itself instead of having an add-on for another add-on for uh DA networks and we are also trying to fix the loss

composibility across L1's and L2s. Uh I'm sure you've been u looking at Vitalik's tweets over the last couple of weeks about uh L1's and L2s and how the number of uh L2s don't make sense in this industry anymore because Ethereum itself has scaled to a decent level uh with lower gas fees and uh another important uh component that we are trying to replace is the central layers. Most of the DAPs still depend on uh centralized layers. So the logos blockchain eventually wants to be a solution for this. And that's pretty much about the Logos blockchain. And we

were previously known as Nomos and uh we've rebranded to Logos Blockchain as I mentioned before, but it's pretty much the same project. And going ahead with messaging, uh messaging was called Vaku. Uh I'm going to put up the website here. I'm sure some of you might be familiar. Oh, looks like we've uh rebranded the website as well. But uh Baku is uh this particular uh protocol which was being used by multiple uh projects in the past. Like I mentioned, uh Waku uh has been uh quoted by Vitalik

a lot of times in his blog post and uh tweets u in the last few years. And uh the way waku works is it's a it's no longer waku but the way logos messaging works is it's a gossip sub network built on top of lip p2p and uh with waku you can you were able to send messages uh into the waku network but in terms of the logos messaging you should be able to use it when you run the logo score uh application itself and Uh yeah more details about logos messaging can be found within our website but uh for

the sake of the presentation this can uh replace centralized solutions like uh discord or telegram servers uh API gateways and centralized coordination tools. Uh we have a lot of applications built on top of uh logos messaging and one of the most prominent ones is the status app. Uh status app is also a part of the IFT umbrella and uh you can download the app for Mac OS uh as a desktop app or for Windows or Linux or mobile based on your preference already and uh status app uses vaku not just for messaging but for various other things

including um state management across multiple users etc. So yeah, this is uh a great alternative to Discord provided that we had some uh issues with Discord in the last last few days. Uh Discord has been uh kind of trending for the privacy side of things. So yeah, it's already available. A lot of projects are using it already. So make sure to check out Logos Messaging. And uh the highlights of Logos messaging are that uh this uh full sender receiver uh unlinkable. Uh so if you send a message into logos messaging network, you should

be able to be sure that there's no way to link the sender or the receiver with the message. It's completely anonymous. And we are also bringing uh rate limiting without uh compromising on your privacy uh using a technology which was again evangelized by Ethereum Foundation. It's called RLN and you can find that uh find more about it in uh PSC privacy scaling explorations uh which is a part of the Ethereum Foundation. Uh you should be able to find this over here. uh RLN yeah create limiting nullifiers.

Uh yeah, you can find this in the project section and this is already implemented into uh into logos messaging. Uh and um this brings in uh this brings in uh rate limiting in the form of spam protection. So people can't uh can't dodo the network. Uh DOS meaning denial of service uh distributed denial of service. So yeah uh you can't uh bring the network down by carrying out a uh DOS attack and RLN is uh ZK powered way in which uh we have a a proof generation happening on client

side and there's uh membership contract which makes sure that uh you have reputation to be able to send a message and you get slashed if you uh spam the network with uh message messages that are crossing the rate limit. So that's about um Arlin and this also capabilities for being able to run this in resource restricted environments. Uh you can run a vaku node in mobile already uh by using our uh JS vaku library which is sunsetted right now. uh like I mentioned because of a logo score we wanted to focus completely on logo score but uh if you want to build an

application with logos messaging we have uh pretty much everything that you want to be able to do it uh and finally this storage uh we have uh logo storage which is the rebrand of codeex and with this you can uh build content address storage within your applications s each and every file that you upload into uh logo storage would be content addressed meaning that uh the files are addressed or identified by using a hash uh just like IPFS and uh we also have a higher durability than IPFS in terms of uh the file being in the network for a set amount of time. uh

logo storage uh proposes multiple uh techniques to make sure that uh the file will be having the uptime for the maximum reliability and there's also private retrievalss which is kind of useful when you combine it with uh a priv privacy preserving blockchain like uh logos. So yeah, there's uh private retrievalss available and uh logos storage uh is still not public yet. So uh this further announcements are expected in the next month when we are launching our test net and uh eventually we want this to replace AWS S3 buckets IPFS gateways that relay on centralized

providers uh and RV nodes and any form of centralized CDN. Uh so yeah that's about logo storage but uh more public information about this would be available eventually although everything uh in our working uh setup is open source so you can find research RFPs and uh code implementations in GitHub already but uh we just trying to document it better so that uh it's easier for uh everyone to digest it. Uh so looking at the next generation of privacy first applications uh we have multiple things that logos wants to

enable uh in the next few months and uh there's also a lot of builder grants that we have in place and I will be giving a sneak peek of them uh in the next few minutes and uh DAP learning will be the first community to know about these builder grants and uh these builder grants uh value for more than 1 million uh in uh US dollars equivalent of pricing. But yeah, they're already uh about to get live in the next few weeks. And uh uh we're happy to support anyone who wishes to build on top of Logos for all these use cases that we have in mind. And u this is just a a table which describes different things that Logos

tries to enable and how it tries to enable. uh this presentation will also be shared to you uh later. So you can check this out but I'll also be sharing a link to our RFP program which is our form of grants program. Uh this will be available in uh our GitHub repository eventually. We just set this up recently and uh we are yet to have RFPs populated into our RFP repository, but you can expect to have RFPs live and in place by uh March, early March. So yeah, this is a great alpha for you. If you are already planning to build on top of

Logos, you can make use of the RFP program to get your uh initial funding sorted. And we also have other uh other uh competitive campaigns uh in the coming days. And uh we have our first uh test net launch event called the parallel societies conference. Uh and you can find this in ps.logos.co and uh this is set to take place in Lisbon on 6th uh and 7th of March. So this is where we have a lot of testn net announcements coming up. We also have a lot of information about RFPs launching here and we also have some competitive

bounties for you to uh capture if you are looking to build with logos. So uh do check it out if you are able to travel to Lisbon on these dates. Uh but we will also have some asyn components happening on discord. So yeah, make sure to join discord or uh in the best case we'll be happy to see you at parallel societies. And uh going ahead uh there are three main reasons to build on top of logos. If you are familiar with Rust as a smart contract programming language, you can build applications already when we launch the test net and we really want to have uh uh the initial set of RS

developers uh who are ready to give us feedback and we are also having a lot of uh feedback based uh RFPs in place. So we will be incentivizing you for uh providing feedback for us in any form and again all of these information will be eventually found on our uh RFP repository and also on our socials uh when we have things in place. But uh yeah, we are really looking for Rust developers to give us feedback and um with Logos, you can deploy directly on the backtoback decentralized infrastructure without having to rely on operational things like uh or DevOps uh

specifically where you need to deploy an application into AWS or anything of that sort. With Logos, everything is uh everything is uh decentralized from the get- go. And you can publish applications without any of these DevOps dependencies. And you can also use in protocol privacy primitives with a familiar accountsbased model uh which makes it easier to build uh user experiences uh which won't differ a lot from the existing ones. So yeah, three main reasons to go build on top of logos with privacy being in its core. And uh finally uh you can join the movement by

going to uh the link in the QR. I will also share the link on the chat. It's you can find that in our website. We have a form called the take action form and you can uh simply sign up for the test net by going to the website and then pressing the get started button. This should uh help you register your interest for the Logos test net uh as a node operator or as a builder and um this will also help you stay updated with our further announcements. But please uh expect the test net to be uh live by the next month. So it's not

long. Uh it's just a just like just a couple of weeks ahead. So you'll be uh informed about things earlier uh like the RFP program. So this is the best time to start contributing to logos. And if you're not a builder or a node operator, you can also uh start your own circles. Uh we have multiple circles around the world and logo circles have been uh pretty active in the last couple of uh months. Uh you can find more information about the logo circles over here. uh you can go to the links up here and there's also a contribute section which I'll be talking about but this logo circles here and you can find

more about circles how to start your own regional circle we have multiple circles around the world uh uh we just had like a meet up in London a couple of weeks ago and it went pretty well we had a lot of activists joining us in person and logo circles are basically communityrun events events or communities uh around the world. Uh we have multiple circles and you can start one in your own city and uh you can also look at the existing circles around the world and the events calendar is linked up. So if there's an event happening near you uh make sure to uh check it out. And there's also uh multiple pinnable issues that circles

are trying to solve. For example, at the uh London Circle, we have this winnable issue for uh the digital ids that the UK is proposing. Uh I can also do a quick Google search for it. Uh so apparently uh we have uh something called digital IDs coming up in the UK which uh compromises civil liberties in a lot of ways uh at least according to me personally. And we did have a lot of protests go in and around London in the last few months. And uh we did have a petition introduced in the uh UK government uh petition website. Uh and

the parliament also debated on this topic. uh we've had more than uh close to 3 million signatures for this petition and the topic is still relevant and um with the logo circle in London we are trying to uh do a bit more research into it and propose a blockchain based solution or at least uh propose something that uh can leverage the existing uh system with something that has blockchain or privacy preserving technologies in it and um the form of output that we are looking to uh provide uh is blog posts. So we have a plans for

u publishing one blog post from our London circle every month about this topic to make it to make more people more aware about what the problem with digital ID is and how blockchain can solve this. So when you solve a uh when you start a circle, you can uh pick up a a winnable issue just like we did and uh you can have your own community propose these winnable issues and yeah you can solve it in any novel way that you want and we already have circles around the world. So you can go ahead to this link to learn more about it or uh start your own circle.

And uh finally I would also uh like to showcase this contribute page that we have with logos. Uh this is a page that you can make use of if you uh wish to start contributing for open source issues that that are existent in the logos ecosystem. We've had more than 2,000 contributors uh contribute for us on GitHub and more than 137 active contributors who make weekly contributions. And yeah, you can go ahead over here and you can see all the issues that different circles are uh trying to solve and also different issues that the community is proposing. Uh for example,

someone wants to build a logos forward CMS and you can learn more about it over here. Uh uh sorry grew. Uh sorry to interrupt. Do you want to share the screen of your browsers? And now we are still see your PowerPoint. >> Oh oops. Okay. Let me >> Yeah. Cool. I hope it's visible now. >> Yeah. Yeah. Perfect. Uh yeah. So we have a contribute portal over here. Like I mentioned, it's contribute.logos.co and uh we have all the issues listed over here and you can pick up on any of

these issues and start solving them already and most of these issues are directly from the community. So uh you already know where to find uh issues to start contributing to and there's also a community directory which kind of uh helps you understand different people who contribute to us and uh finally there's also a leaderboard where you can see people contributing to different issues. But again uh we have a circles page in the website uh where you can know more about circles around the world and also start your own circle. We we have a lot of local communities around the world and uh yeah you can simply start start a circles by hitting this

button uh propose a new circle or you can also join a existing circle and circles don't need any technical competency which means you can also uh join circle without being a node operator or a developer but if you are a developer uh please make sure to uh sign up for our test weight list which is over here. Press the get started button and you should be able to see a form here uh which asks you just for your email and your role as a node operator or as a builder and we will be uh keeping you updated about our test net announcements uh from in the next month and again a final shout out to our

event. If you are able to travel to Lisbon next month, we have private parallel societies uh congress happening on 6th and 7th of March. Uh and we are planning to introduce a lot of builder programs which include the RFP program. Uh and you can find more about the RFP program in this repository. And uh yeah, that's pretty much it. Uh this is still early. We just uh started adding more RFPs into our RFP program uh in the last month. Uh so you should be able to find these RF RFPs listed over here. And uh yeah, you'll be this is kind of an alpha

because we don't uh think any other community knows about this yet. So yeah, make use of the RFP program. Uh we are expecting to have uh grants valued for more than a million dollars. So all of these will be inside this in the next couple of weeks. So all you have to do is to go to this link and sign up for our uh test net announcements. So that should be it from me today. Uh and you can also find our discord uh link over here. So if you have any questions uh we we are very happy to answer you on discord or if you have questions I can also answer them over here.

Uh yeah, thanks. By the way, could you share the GitHub link to the chat box? Yeah, just for the convenience. Yeah. >> Yep. 100%. >> Okay. Um okay and uh yeah before the sharing starts we gather some questions from our communities. Um yeah we have three questions about uh logos and after these three questions uh we will ask anyone

having any other questions and we can answer it. Yeah, the first one um yeah, since the logos application abandons the browser architectures, the classical browser architectures, can already developers keep using the React or VE stacks or we have to learn the new languages and tools like like Ras or something? >> Uh yes. So we are uh definitely aiming to get rid of the browsers with our approach. Uh this is going to be more on the local first or uh desktop first level.

>> Mhm. >> And uh yeah to answer your question about uh the languages or frameworks to build of logos. >> Uh right now we have examples that use QT uh based interfaces. uh QTS uh more to desktop applications. So we don't have React examples or JavaScript examples as of yet, >> but this should be something in our road map down the line because we're looking at full decentralization. We we've picked up QT as uh the candidate for the time being. But yeah, eventually we'll have examples for different frameworks.

Uh for something like a desktop application with JavaScript and React, there's something called Electron which I've been using for a long time. And there's also a desktop application framework called Tori uh which is pretty good. >> We plan to have example applications or boiler plates for all these frameworks eventually. Okay, thanks for your answers. I think I mean that's a good news that React and the Vue or other uh stacks are on the road map.

>> Okay, the next one. Um yeah, in the slides of the local storage you introduce so-called private retrieval. uh man or whether this kind of reprieval can cause noticeable latencies like uh you know FTP I mean when loading large failed like videos or some big big pictures or do you have any benchmark or performance uh checking for that? Yeah, I I don't think we have public benchmarks available as of yet. Uh but uh we definitely plan to have them very soon and one of uh the most important

benchmarks that we plan to have before the test net launch is the hardware requirements for node operators. But in terms of uh how Logos works, uh Logos score should be able to run in any uh home machine, which means should be able to run in a laptop that you use regularly. And uh when we also look at uh the node operators uh we also have a special emphasis on having home home based uh node operators which is >> again like resource restricted environments not cloud providers and >> that way everyone is a node operator within the logos ecosystem. Uh if you

run logo score this means that you are running a full node in your machine. So yeah, I think that's pretty much the answer that we have right now, but uh we will eventually have a more detailed benchmarking on logo score performance. Okay, thanks. Just now you mentioned that um everyone should have the ability to run the logo logo node in their own machines. a man or whether it require high upload speeds like you know I mean as a nodes the nodes must face lots of traffic upload and download is any requirements for the network or the some like public

network is a must or upload speed has has to exceed like 50 megabytes per second is there any requirement for that >> I think that's a really great question uh because uh like in terms of logos we are completely getting rid of the RPC layer which means that you are interacting with the blockchains directly or the peer-to-peer network directly and uh yeah there's no uh we don't have any set uh numbers for like upload speed or download speed but then uh we are still yet to benchmark the whole experience for logo score because logo score right now just exists

as a a QT application in our GitHub and uh yeah this is definitely not the kind of logo score that is going to be launched next month so yeah we are trying to get it out along with benchmarks uh but yeah we I I'll definitely note that benchmarks is a uh requirement from the community and I'll let my team know that having benchmarks would Uh great when we launch application. >> Okay. Yeah. Thanks for your answers. And uh here the last one. Um yeah, previously uh you said uh the RL N. Uh could you like to tell us like what is

short for? It may be confusing for some audience. >> Uh sure. Uh so RLN uh stands for rate limiting nullifiers and this is a project uh primarily developed by uh privacy scaling explorations in the Ethereum foundation and uh the way RLN works is it can make your decentralized and private networks uh DOS resistant. So if there's Bob and Alice and Alice is a >> a user who respects uh the rate limits or uh the limits of the network so that it doesn't get spammed. But Bob who is a malicious actor and Bob wants to get the network down by spamming the network

with let's say thousand requests uh for a second >> and [clears throat] the way Arlin works is by blacklisting bad actors like Bob uh without >> knowing who Bob actually is. So yeah, it makes sure that you're private but also uh brings in DOS or rate limiting without needing to verify an identity or without needing to reveal an identity. So yeah, that's a very high level definition for >> Arlin. But Arlin is implemented in different parts within Logos. uh and one of the most prominent areas is the logos messaging area which is uh previously waku. Waku was using for quite a bit and

we are still using it in logos messaging as well. >> Okay. See, so it's called limit network and I regard it uh as a kind of network using the inking x this kind of proxy projects or it's totally different. Uh you can imagine this to be something like NYM nim. Uh >> okay name. >> Yeah but but nim could be one of the use cases that can be built on top of logos but it's not exactly logos but uh NIM is definitely one of the use cases. uh NIM is more of a VPN based approach but with

uh with logos we're taking a a hybrid between blockchain based approach and uh a torrent based approach because uh the biggest difference is for using any layer 1 or layer 2 in the market right now you simply uh you know pick up an RPC generate API keys and then you you just use it with an RPC but with logos we are taking the torrent based approach where you download a client application that uh that integrates our logos binaries in the form of logos core. But yeah, like with VPNs, I I don't think it's the same. It's a completely different approach and it has a lot more tradeoffs than the blockchain approach

or uh the approach that we take. >> Okay, thanks for your detailed answers. I think I finished my part. Uh and uh for the audience uh is anyone uh having questions about logos or his network or um anything about that? Here's your chance. >> Okay. Yeah. Thanks for sharing the discord. Yeah.

Okay. I I would assume silence means no. No one has any more questions about logos network. Okay, let's thanks gurus for sharing this wonderful presentation. >> Yeah, I think that's uh that's today's Yeah, thanks guru. Thanks for coming. Hope to see you in the future. >> Thanks so much and again feel free to ask any questions subsequently in the discord. We have our core contributors waiting for your questions. So, uh, see you there.