Is forking a DAO treasury a feature or a bug?

Transcript

GM GM welcome to web 3 Academy your one trusted source to capitalize on the next big phase of the internet don't get caught in the hype cycle I'm jbird and I believe that forking is going to change the world that's why I'm carving a path for doers to confidently build and invest in web 3 welcome welcome y'all to another episode today we are talking about forking is forking a bug or a feature is forking a good thing or a bad thing in the crypto blockchain web 3 world forking has really been seen as a bad thing for a while now however a recent Dow vote from nouns Dow where they decided to Fork has led a lot of

people to feel like okay maybe forking is actually a good thing and it might create potential opportunities and new ways that we can coordinate with decentralized organizations that we hadn't really thought of before and it's really opening a lot of people's eyes and noun is as they always do really leading the way today we have Jeff Kaufman with us on the show Jeff old friend of the show been on the show multiple times before brings with him his knowledge from jump one of the leading web3 communities that he has been working in building in the space for two years now and today Jeff and I are really going to talk about why do we need decentralized governments why do we

need Dows like do these things really serve purpose is it just another buzzword another acronym that's hot today or is there some bigger purpose here that's here to say and then we talk about are Dows working what are some examples of them working where are they not then we're going to get into really the meat of this conversation which is nouns Dow the fork that just happened and then a new proposal out of nouns da around what the future should look like in terms of this ability to fork and potentially Arbitrage this price which has led to a lot of speculation in the Dow and if you don't understand exactly what I'm talking about so okay we're going to explain it all to you in today's episode and make sure you stick

around to the end because Jeff has some hot takes on forking and why he really believes that forking is a good thing and that it's a new meta in the space that we haven't seen before that is probably going to lead to some exciting new experiments and some new ways that we can use blockchain for better in the world and the way that we coordinate humans through Dows and through onchain governance fascinating conversation today you're just going to absolutely love everything that Jeff shares and these takes around Dows forking fascinating and one of the most interesting things before we jump in is

that with this Fork that happened in noun Dow the Dow gave up they basically re refunded over 470 people in their Dow they refunded them 35 e each and as a result they gave up more than half of their treasury back to their original holders that's a big decision you millions of dollars 20 over $25 million that they gave back so a lot of people would say oh no that's that's awful you you lost your treasury you're having conflict people are voting against you all these things really bring up this feeling of of a of a bad situation but it's not necessarily exactly all it appears to be there's more behind the

scenes that we're going to jump into in today's episode super excited to jump in today's episode with Jeff but before we do I just want to make sure you know that today is the last day that you can get 33% off on our web 3 investing Master Class you can buy in crypto now we just started accepting crypto payments last week and that's why we're giving you this 33% discount right now so that you can you can pay in your crypto you could also pay in your Fiat if you want either way you can get a 33% discount and you know what you're going to want to grab this course now because the ethereum ETFs just got approved there's some big things happening in the

space some big things that are going to come in the next few months and the ethereum ETFs alone what's the impact going to be on the market is that going to move the market are we entering a bull run how should you be deploy your Capital how do you think about your portfolio management which tokens should you be investing in should you be investing in nfts or should you focus more on fible token all these things are questions we answer in our web three investing master class so go ahead and make sure you sign up link is in the show notes get 33% off today is the last day modern newsletters are built on paragraph that's right paragraph is a brand new newsletter platform that combines the best parts of web 2 and web 3 to supercharge newsletters for both

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of newsletters because of the profound engagement it creates between creators and fans so whether you're a Creator writer or an Avid Reader it's time to check out paragraph and capitalize on the opportunity of being early GM Jeff Kaufman welcome back to web3 Academy awesome I'm glad to be here it's been a couple months and I feel like there's a lot of updates and this is my first time on the hot takes show so ready for ready to spit out the hot takes I love it man you always got the hot takes on Twitter you know you're very appropriate for this show I think you've been on the show already three times so you're becoming one of our top guest fourth

this is the fourth this is the fourths that feels right yeah yeah so excited to chat today about Dows and forking and what happened with n's Dow and we I think we all know the news of what happened with NSD but today we want to more focus on what's next for Dows and now that Dows can Fork I mean obviously they always could Fork that's not new but we had never really seen a dow Fork before and in such a meaningful way where we had basically $25 million that was taken out of a treasury like it's not a small decision what does that mean for proun Dow and how does that impact the future of dows and the future of

decentralized governments real be a very interesting conversation I want to sort of start high level uh I think a lot of people are missing the forest of the trees right now around Dows and there's a lot of the negative uh media about Dows not working basically and I'm not surprised that they're not working it's a new structure it's a new any sort of when you're using new tech and also trying to build an organization it's not going to be simple but before we get into are they working are they not I just want to sort of start at a high level of like Jeff in your mind why do we need Dows or why do we need decentralized governance first first hot take Dows are not new so when you just look at the three words anded out

decentralized autonomous organization nothing in that says that it has to be web 3 blockchain now when I think about Dows in context of web 3 and blockchain and crypto we start to enter an internet native organization or an organization that can operate at internet scale and internet speed but really you could have a hundred people no crypto no technology and if they set up the right structure and they abide by those rules then it can operate in a totally decentralized autonomous way so that's my first hot take I'm gonna leave

it there yeah I think that what comes up for me is and I completely agree that Dows with nothing new I the easy example that I've heard multiple times is Alcoholics Anonymous as there go the the oldest Dows uh yeah it's not using the term Dow but it is a decentralized organization there's chapters all around the world they follow follow a certain format it's totally autonomous though anybody can set up a traper and it is an an organization they do follow a path not a path but a a certain model or method that they follow which is really one of the keys to any decentralized organization is like the you need a

clear North Star and you need some sort of like system that you use over and over again so it makes it easy could be decentralized sort of going back to the initial question of like why do we need Dows I I think that the the question is not why do we need Dows I think it's more of like why do we need decentralized governance and when I say decentralized governance I mean just like I I think about sort of three things come up for me one is we must govern our communities I think it comes back to the simple governance that we have in terms of voting in our elections right depending on whatever country you're from I'm sure I hope you vote in whether municipal or state or Countrywide you vote in elections and

like that is a form of civic responsibility that is so important and what we've seen I think and the reason the Dows have so much potential is that organizations are profit driven and so when you have profit driven you're going to make decisions based upon as you should to maximize profit I can't hate anybody who's making decisions for those reasons but that has led to a situation where where a lot of organizations are not doing what's best for the community and so we need new forms of governance which allow users and customers and community members to have more say in the direction of an organization the

direction of a product and the direction and the decisions that they're making and so that's one of the key things I think of what why we need decentralized governance and obviously you don't need blockchain to do that but blockchain does I was going to say it makes it better but there's always that level of like current ux that I'm not sure that it does make it better but once the ux is is as it gets figured out which it is it does make it better you want to jump in there yeah well I would say there's a lot of dows that haven't worked so then we get this narrative that Dows are sort of struggling but the reality is what 95% of businesses fail 99% 99 yeah most Dows are not gonna work that's most

organizations most ideas are crap I've had a most ideas are bad I'm just willing to keep having bad ideas until a good one emerges so but there are some Dows that are working I mean largely ethereum is more or less a dow gitcoin is working wonderfully now the thing about something like gitcoin is clear Mission clear set of values clear set of sort of protocols that were built over time and how people participate and where value goes we are seeing Dows in the web three cents and that just knowing that if you

just know that dcoin is actually working really well and that's not to say that it's perfect it could certainly be a thousand times better but considering how early we are in this space to have that as an example of that it's working and then as we get into nouns I think nouns is working beautifully it's just early stage right and any startup in the first year let's not forget this organization is only a year old so it's going to go through its growing pains and all the growing pains are out in the world for everyone to see a lot of growing pains nobody ever sees I agree though why do we need decentralized governance and it's just the fact that

there's a lot of things in our lives that not a single entity or organization needs to control it either needs to controlled by a set of organizations control the thing which that I'm actually really bullish on that and I don't people are talking about that enough why do I think of that it goes back to participation within Dows a lot of people do not participate and that voting and that participation people are busy they have babies they have jobs it's like ah there these five Dows that I'm super interested in and I want to consume their products or services but I don't have time to participate at

a meaningful level so I'm really I I really think the space of organizations participating together is underere exort at least in web 3 there's plenty of examples of that in sort of the traditional world MH MH it's really interesting you bring up this concept of rather than it be completely decentralized that you have a few organizations that sort of speak for the people we spoke to a few months ago hadera which is an L1 that uses a governing Council of it's 30 uh organizations but I think there's only

like 28 organizations that fill the C 30 seats now but it's like it's Google it's boing it's like some major universities and educational institutions and that's who governs hadera and so you might say oh that's not decentralized but once you get to decentralized tomorrow we have a podcast coming out with Zach who's a very involved member at APCO Dow and he talks about how APCO Dow has 70,000 members in it and only about less than a thousand will vote each time and the problem is because the way that Dow works is it's all based off weight and voting so Mackie big brother comes in and he has 4 million apoin and he can

swing any vote so you have issues around the the mechanism that is used to manage the vote I think just coming back to the the initial point one more time is human coordination is very difficult and blockchain is the first time that we can C coordinate humans based upon their activity within an ecosystem the best example of this is is op token where you have been different people have been aird dropped op token for as a result of their activity on op chain and your op token is also a governing token and so you can govern and the thinking is that

you know the people that are interacting the most the ones that will should participate in governance and so you're giving you're not just giving away value and it that's one thing that like most of us miss is we're so focused on speculation in web 3 that we're always thinking about like oh great I get a token like what's it worth what's the value of that but what we're not talking about enough is that a lot of the times when they do these airdrops you're also getting governance and that that is actually just as important with the caveat being that a lot of there is obviously an issue around rer apathy which is why I don't know if you saw but op token last week did another drop and there their drop they did last week this is a third air drop it wasn't based upon activity on op

chain it was based upon governance activity so you either had to participate in a vote to get the ne that airdrop or you had to just delegate as long as you delegated your vote and then the person who had you delegated your vote to actually used your vote then you got the airdrop so they're rewarding that participation in governance which is a great example of using Dow mechanics to ensure that people are governing you know what's funny about them airdropping these tokens and basically this highly centralized team is setting rules for this de Central it's like yeah there a lot of centralization in that conversation but don't we but don't you think we need that though like you said yourself like

gitcoin started very centralized right it's very difficult to start decentralized I don't even know how you could start decentralized because you need in the beginning you need clear Direction you need Vision you need a few people that are pushing and and trying to get somewhere and if you do that decentralize usually it doesn't work because you just have too many people sitting around and not no one's actually making decisions that's why to get there it especially to get there fast it has to be built into the protocol or the technology in some way so you look at Bitcoin for example yeah highly centralized in terms of writing the white paper doing the first set of sort of code and software implementation and

then publishing it but as soon as the miners come in and they start acting right and it builds and it gets decentralized very quickly nouns is a good example on day one one person buys they control the whole treasury good whole treasury right but very quickly in 30 days you know in a 100 days in three one year 365 people and this is one of the reasons why I don't think down nouns should be that noun should be at the top of everybody's radar in a very intense way if you care about Dows because the experiments and how it's being run is so bleeding edge there is just no example of a treasury that is as decentralized

as nouns and so it's totally fascinating I think something big is going to come out now on SL turn I love the optimistic attitude you always bring to the show jaff okay let's talk about noun then so I'm sure everybody listening knows this but if you don't know this in case you missed it we wrote in newsletter on it and we talked about it on the podcast the past few weeks but nouns Dow had a vote to Fork basically there was a lot of people who paid a high price to get their noun and they started to do the math as nouns as the price of nouns decreased and it got down to I think

about 25 eth they realized that a 25 e noun was actually technically underpriced of if you took the whole Treasury and divid it by the number of nouns that were out there the price of a noun should have been more like 35 E and A lot of people didn't like that you could get in to this treasury with such a low price so this boat was proposed to Fork they ended up forking just over go ahead Jeff I I was just going to say what is also interesting about the fork is that there was a vote and a proposal before the fork to implement the technology to do the

fork right so this for game mechanic and we're going to definitely get into it is built into the protocol so before the vote would happened to go fort there was a proposal that said we need the technology to do the fork in an onchain way and that's part of the nouns ethos is that it's all has to be onchain it all has to be at the protocol level and so there was that original proposal to actually build the forking mechanic into the protocol itself which has never been done and anytime I come across something that is like this has never been done at least not that I'm aware of I haven't

seen anyone reference something like like that that is huge so they built it right into the protocol and then basically a group of people came in and said we're going to use the feature that is now in the protocol and that feature is front and center for any noun holder to initiate a fort at any time so okay let I'll finish and then I want to get back to this this Fork feature and is it a feature is it a bug because there's obviously worries when you have this Fork feature so the news of what did happen a few weeks ago when this this Fork was proposed and it went it was live anybody could basically

essentially opt out of the Dow so the fork allowed whoever voted to be out that you would get 35 eth refund from the Dow so 35 eth would be taken out of the Dow treasury paid back to you and you would essentially return your noun I'm not sure if they decided what they're going to do with these nouns but now this Tre the treasury has these nouns back in the Dow so as a result of that they lost it was just over half I don't remember the exact number but it was just over half of the nouns there was over 800 nouns and over just over half decided to leave and so as a result they also lost half their treasury still have a significant treasury I think it's

still around 25 million what's next Jeff and where do you think this goes I know you're excited about this concept of working what do you think it enables so they have one challenge that they have to solve for and once they figure out this one challenge then it's Off to the Races so the challenge that they have to figure out right now is how to keep people ju forking for one reason which is the Arbitrage the ethal which is what you just covered right and so that Arbitrage opportunity continues to exist and people will continue to to do that but here's what what this one big exit did is it took all the people who wanted to Arbitrage that weren't aligned with

this sort of Greater vision and wanting to push the nouns Dow forward and this experiment forward it took all the people that see that Arbitrage and they're more attracted to that than the mission itself all those people essentially left right and so now there's sort of this scenario where new people come in are they going to be the Arbitrage type of person or are they going to be the mission aligned person are they mercenaries or are they this right and right now that Arbitrage amount that you talked about the 35 25 it still exists so there are still people and maybe there's these individuals that exit and now they're

going to come back in and they're just going to keep doing it they're just going toat that Arbitrage that's a problem ultimately but that problem forces the the Dow itself to figure out the solution because for that a specific problem the reason is why is forking important why is it not feature well it's basically to say Hey listen we've got all these people that are sort of aligned in this Mission but there are certain uses of the treasury that not everybody's going to fully understand the rationale how to do it they're not going to understand the benefits well if there's a group of people let's just use marketing for

example a lot of software developers they don't understand marketing and how great would it be if the 10 to 20 people holding an nouns who really understood marketing were like wow if we could just take our portion of the treasury and go do what we know is important or meaningful with marketing and we don't have to have these other people who just don't get it in our business cool we can Fork out and we can actually run a sown and we can create value around that and forking ultimately it only propagates the brand or the meme right the more fors that

exist the more teams that are out there doing interesting things and you know I can see a world where some of these Forks actually end up creating very sustainable businesses where they're they are self- sustaining in and of themselves that's only going to be good and sort of the analogy I'll use is just like early settlers in some country you know they all start in this original sort of space but then eventually somebody has ideas that other people don't like and there's differencing opinions and they're like all right well we're going to March a hundred miles that way and we're going

to go you know set up our own little town but we all still believe in some sort of higher shared sort of value and alignment and so we're still going to be structurally aligned at a certain layer and then over times you go from one settlement to a hundred settlements and as long as there's some sort of alignment so that they don't fight against each other then the broader system gets very very strong and that's what I see now which is unparalleled in the digital world yeah it's interesting because so leading up to this Fork the price of

nouns sort of settled in around 35 eth because either there was there's people who are maintaining the floor on the noun side who really believe in nouns and are like I'm going to make sure that each noun each auction that happens each day permission asly forever that that 35 e Flor is maintained and then if you did decide to leave through the fork you would get your 35 e refund so it made sense that sort of settle to that price but since then the price of the nouns has dropped and I was just looking the day after the fork the next day it was down to like there was a 15 eth now and then there's been some low te some High Teens some 20s and it's kind of BU back

up to 30 e but you can see so there is this risk that people are just going to as you said Arbitrage it they're just going to say oh like great I'm going to buy it now and then I'm going to prod up a proposal that we fork and that the price on a fork would should be 35 e and try to get that to happen again because there is some people that did you know again there's always going to be speculation in this space there's some people that they're using this as a way to make money not because they care at all about being part of noun Dow and spreading the IP of you know the cool sunglasses like that's not what they there they have some new proposals but how do they avoid this continuing to happen so one it's just interesting well

what if it just continues to happen right what if it just continues to play out that's one possible path that's worth just intellectually saying what happens well what happens there is the price of nouns just gets lower and lower and lower and lower and lower and it keeps getting these basically these arbitragers kind of keep going out but at the end of the day I think what's left is an incredibly strong group of people and they got this mechanic to continually fund the treasury forever and ever and ever I think that it's actually okay if they don't do anything I think it takes a long time to

sort itself out and we just kind of hear this narrative beating of just like oh another Fort to Arbitrage another Fork to Arbitrage but it's just just this cleaning system that will take some time to sort out so well what happens if the Dow wants to not go through that painful process and potentially it burns and you know completely crashes right but so there's a proposal out that basically says okay well there's this Arbitrage amount where people can just come in and profit right so how do we just remove that how do we just take care of that amount make sure it doesn't exist The Proposal is basically it tracks again all this is

done at the protocol level so the protocol would track that Arbitrage amount and after a certain number of days that amount that's in the treasury that amount of eath would just get burned just Dr just completely burned and then the amount that you could pull out per noun if you were to for work would then be equal to the auction price so then anybody buying would be like well literally I'm not buying to Arbitrage out unless you were speculating that somehow the value of the treasury would increase based off of and to date we

actually haven't seen that happen we basically have seen the first noun was sold for 600 eth yeah that person's getting person not not getting their value yeah their vote cost a lot more than everybody else's vot right so this proposal says okay we'll just burn that and how but they'll just burn it like they'll just burn burn the yeah they're not gonna like put it into like another fund or something like that just like taking money and just lighting it on Lighting on fire the way to think about it is it's a penalty on the Dow for not using the funds what else is creating this Arbitrage amount they're not spending the eth the Dow is not passing

proposals they're just continuing to accumulate this treasury this is not what we're necessarily here for just to like have a huge treasury that doesn't do anything and that's why if you go back to originally why is the Arbitrage opportunity there it's because the dowo does not pass proposals to spin eth at the at a high enough rate so this is basically saying get to work spin do stuff pass proposals this new proposal that's proposing to basically put this burn mechanic if the Dow

doesn't pass proposals and spin the eth it's basically saying we're going to put this in at the protocol level to force this Behavior if the Dow itself is not gonna get out in front of it and do it right I mean I'm ironically it sort of reminds me of like corporate budgeting season you know and it's like coming to the end of Q4 or the end of you know on year you just sat on your budget you sit on your budget yeah exactly and you're like you literally now don't spend it you lose it now that Corporation isn't burning that money but they're going to remove it from your budget if you're you know a marketing person or a product person or whatever budget you control

you're going to lose those funds it's just wild to think I get the the mechanic makes total sense that it does Force action because as you said they're not spending it at enough of a rate so the treasury is increasing which some people would say wow that's amazing we're building this great big treasury but most people are like but who cares I don't what does that do for for me I'm here because I want us to grow the nouns brand which means we need to spend the treasury we're not trying to be an investment Dow that might invest this treasury right so yes so it it does for burning it is such a heavy find on them like that's the that you can't take that back is literally burning cash I don't think we have any example of that ever happening before no exactly and I I mean

if I were in the nouns so I initially lean towards I would vote Yes for that proposal now I would need to do a lot more research in terms of understanding is that protocol is implementing that at the protocol level that burning mechanic is it reversible so basically can you run that experiment and then decide as a community God that is not working can you pass a new proposal to pull that out be much more likely to vote for it if you can reverse a decision if you can't reverse a decision I'd have to really think a lot harder about it but what I love about all this is it's truly

forcing people to decentralize government governance and basically subd Dows it's creating that opportunity to Exist by implementing this ability to Fork at any moment and right now it's used for basically speculation which a lot of crypto speculation leads to participation and the markets are built around speculation and there was a great article that talked about how the majority of the US getting started in the early days was all so much of it was speculation and profit seeking and so much of people heading from the east coast to the West Coast was all about the gold rush and speculation and mercenaries just going

trying to make their bags was a big reason why a lot of these Trails opened up a lot of Pathways across the country a a good portion of the infrastructure and the opportunity in the cities was purely built from a speculation perspective and so this forking mechanic was built basically out of people who are speculating and you can see how this forking mechanic is actually a feature if you say okay this Arbitrage opportunity is removed somehow right once it's removed now what's the reason to Fork oh it's because there's a group of us that are

aligned in some way that we think is good and we want to go off and and not have the broader Mothership of The Da have to like tell us no and outvote us and this smaller group may actually be right and oftentimes they are right even if there's a good portion that aren't right when they decide to go fork and do their own thing and build there's gonna be someone some group that is right about whatever idea that they have and it's going to be a game Cher and that's why I think that something huge is gonna come out of nouns long term for these sort of three

reasons bouns is inherently attracting people who highly intelligent people who want to push the boundaries of technology and culture and civilization so the concentration of interesting people is insane right and when really interesting people come together Magic happens so that's number one some of the most interesting people in the world are participating smartest intelligent then number two they are now given the ability to say smaller subsets can take money and go off and do what they think is right and that as a mechanic that can

happen a lot is gonna produce something that is really interesting it's so interesting to think about it as you said when the Arbitrage is dealt with and so if they deal with it with this burn mechanic which I'm trying to think if I would vote for it or against it I would side with what you said that you know would definitely more interested in voting for it if it was a reversible it's a pretty big decision to put at the protocol level if it's not reversible because the thing about all of these decisions is it's so unknown right now everything is trial right we're trying new technologies we're trying new ways

to decentralize government to get people to vote to make decisions together I would be much more likely if it wasn't forever like you said what I do wonder is I think I would also vote for it if I felt like confidently would deal with the Arbitrage issue because I want to move to what you're saying is I want to move to a space where we are actually voting to either be together and make decisions together or to go do our own thing in a sub down that is really really powerful really cool Jeff final hot takes and then I want to get to what's going on with jump and The Economist because I know you got some exciting stuff to share there anything else you want to talk

about on noun out oh no honestly honestly I I think we covered it and my major major recommendation is just like nouns is 100% something that's worth keeping an eye on I've spoken to several people who who really enjoy keeping up with nouns even though they're not olders of the you know the big big daddies and it seems like a lot of us I would put myself included in this went through the same sort of psychological process which was at first we thought wait there's a fork this is terrible this is row Bernie this is worst thing that could happen every fork in the history of crypto has been bad and then you start to look at it and you go no

this is interesting this is the first time it's ever happened and now more excited about nouns than yeah I I agree I don't think Fork is not a bad thing because it enables communities to make decisions on their own and the best example that I think we might see in the future is maker Dow has proposed as part of and I don't want to go too deep down the maker Dow uh ecosystem because it's a bit difficult explain but basically Makow is proposing to create a new chain and they're proposing to create this new chain on salana and this new chain is purely for governance of maker now it's not for the

token the token is going to stay on E but the governance is proposing to move to New chain mainly because governance of maker Dow it's costing too much money right now because they're all on eth and so it's just like governing is like costing you $5 just to make a vat and things like that so that doesn't work well so they're proposing to to move to solada and the reason they're proposing to move to solada for the governance chain is that you can Fork Solana like that's one of the key reasons is that they also believe that forking is a feature because they see that in the future there you might want that ability either as a government or as as an ability to say really one thing the main reasons they wanted is the safety

feature of like okay what if something goes wrong well then it's almost like how it goes back to the initial East Fork that happened back when the Dow got hacked yeah and there's a safety feature of being able to Fork if something went wrong well you can fork and then start again basically so I didn't know everything that you just talked about with maker Dow so that's fascinating to know and that basically leaves me to my final hot take which is the next crazy thing that's going to happen in crypto and web 3 is all going to be centered around forking like if there's one thing because it's basically this idea is propagating right now this is new meta

that people are adopting that are saying oh and the whole thing shifted from forking is bad to forking is good any kind of pendulum swing like that that's that dramatic causes novel and new things happen and if you play this out and you say well what if we have thousands or tens of thousands of projects that have this forking thing in it well now we've just entered a land of web 3 that has never been nothing the last 13 15 years has not been that at all so then we just enter a whole new Dynamic and so I'm going to be most

interested in any projects and anything that's leaning into forking Concepts and like how to encourage I love it okay well be keeping a close eye on that uh also keeping a close eye always on jump one of my favorite communities in the web 3 space and you guys just made a big announcement of a coming partnership with the economist tell us what's going on Jeff yeah if we were to go back into review the slide deck for our first 30 person Zoom phone call two years ago when we said hey we're going to do this community and whatnot one of the bullets on there was that jump should be a platform for the community jump should be a platform for members when you say

platform like that's a very loose term in in this sense but it should be a way for members to really grow their ideas and their brands I've often started to compare jump and say JUMP is head like if that makes sense and so this partnership with the economists around their metaverse Summit which is October 10th in La it's basically I would say we're at an early stage short-term partnership that's that I hope will lead to a long-term partnership right so it's more around this metaverse Summit that's in La uh October 10th basically for Enterprise Brands agencies and and

Builders more Legacy moving into this space and we're basically supporting them in terms of content ideation getting the right people there uh making sure that people are aware of it that are in LA and really just setting the early stages of bringing the right Brands and the right people together and so when you think about our mission of being a thought leadership community and jum being a platform for our community members to who have great ideas get those ideas out into the world a partnership with the economist who has been a thought leader for for quite some time decades is a great brand alignment

for us it's a great brand alignment for the economists as they update their brand right as they evolve and they take the brand that is the economist into these new territories of web 3 and metaverse and AI it's very important for them to align with us to learn from us and you know both sort of grow together yeah well congrats on the partnership with the economist Big Brand great to see them doing stuff in the space just as you said jump is really one of the best web3 communities For Thought leaders that are looking to bring their Enterprise into web3 or startup Founders that are trying to figure out how to

build something in web3 highly recommend we'll put a link in the show notes highly recommend people check out jump and join their Community I also appreciate Jeff that you're so honest about this partnership so easy when you have a big brand like The Economist to just like you know shill it and use it as a way to you know attract a whole bunch of attention but maybe not in the right way speculation basically right so I appreciate that you you're very honest that it's you know short term you're hoping to build it into something more long term I have no doubt that you will Jeff thanks so much again for joining the show today I agree forking is the new meta I really like that hot take to finish we'll see what comes in the next I was going to say in the next year but

probably there will be stuff coming in the next week or the next month because we know how fast this space moves yeah awesome Jay thanks for having me awesome thanks for listening in everybody have a great day thank you for listening to web through Academy your one trusted source to capitalize on the next big phase of the internet if you enjoyed this episode please share it and subscribe or follow so that you don't miss the next one while you're at it there's a link in the description for our free newsletter where we provide timely and relevant web three insight so you can confidently build and invest in web 3 make sure to subscribe today one final note this podcast is for educational purposes only and nothing we say is financial advice crypto and web3 are risky and you should never invest more than you're willing to

lose thank you friends and see you in the next one