EIPIP Meeting 26

Transcript

welcome everyone to eipip meeting 26 this is pooja ranjan sharing the agenda in chat uh the first item that we would like to discuss today is update on contracting out to someone to move the bot to github actions in the last meeting it was discussed that we should discuss it with the cat hurdles to look out for the funds that we uh we estimated in the previous meeting uh there was some interest but we are curious to know like what are the tasks or the job that is expected

and if we can somehow make a document requirement document kind of thing so elite reached out to me on discord and i think i answered her questions the at least the conversation seemed to come to a natural conclusion so i i think they are moving forward basically it was the answer your question puja the requirement is basically just reproduce the current auto merge bot in github actions so other spot lives here it's like one or two python files pretty small the goal is to just reproduce this behavior in a new place sounds good

okay uh so uh the next item is a single source of truth for eip uh brent alsop has been working on this uh so brent if you would like to go ahead and share some details on it yeah mind if i share my screen yeah please go ahead okay see if let me know if i have kind of there can you see that window with all these tabs on it yeah okay cool so so basically i'm trying to focus this down to just pick a a start with some small things to get things started and and let you know the direction i'm pushing just to push or talk to everyone and make sure i'm going in the right direction and

for the first thing that there's this of course ethereum.org that seems to be the descriptive um table of contents for all the information anyone could want about about ether and and one of the links down at the bottom here is you have where all the ethereum improvement proposals which takes you over to this sub link here and this sub link here has some interesting information some of it's kind of old and outdated but um but anyway the bottom line is is is this link here you have the link to this page here and you have the home that goes back to the home page and and so that kind of links this into this official top level ether page but the problem is

is there's the real information that everyone wants is over here on the eips ethereum.org and it's all this stuff up here lincoln and so there's almost no links to this kind of more official appearing one with everyone links to this one it looks kind of odd and another problem with this is it's kind of you've got this link here that's just a link back to this page which is kind of meaningless so that's kind of one of my first proposals is and since there's very few links to this page over here in the eips then i think we should move these and have a goal of eventually making this one a redirect page that

redirects over to eips and um and and so so but before we make that a redirect we need to move clean them up especially this one over here because i think this one here should also like this one here it has this home and ethereum i think we should have this kind of layout so over here we should propose putting a home here that links back to the ethereum dot home page and also do this kind of icon uh in indication up here and and and decorate the page kind of like this and and then also on this clean up here we've got

these two things here eip status and eip types both of those are old and duplicate and out of date so another proposal i would have to clean up this page in addition to having the home link and the icon up here is to i can have jim and i rewrite a paragraph instead of having all this to just describe what because all of the canonical source of this information is my understanding is is eip1 right all of this is defined in the ip1 and it's all updated from this right yeah yeah everyone is right so i would want to replace these two sections here with just description of what eip1 and eip includes this

and it includes this and up and these and these are all out of date and also it includes this out of date this is back over to the eips one this this is an old out of date list which is also on eip1 so basically over here replace this which is the description of what eip1 and the eip1 has a pointing that says eip1 has all the canonical information of this and um and all that would be and then another interesting thing that's over here is there's this uh and again participating stuff is over on eip1 and uh there was some history stuff over here oh yes some of this history but not

this list here because that's in eip1 but but put some of this history and move it over to here and then once we had so the home here and this here and this cleaned up that way i would propose that we'd do all that to this page here and then once that's done we could work on getting this one redirected over to there so does that sound that's kind of my summary of the first thing i think we should work towards does that sound like i'm pushing in the right direction what is the argument for uh removing those two sections yeah from this page and moving them into eip1 versus just moving eip1 into this page oh okay yeah i didn't consider that

um i i just know that we made those changes into eip eip1 so i figured that and those have the update and so so yeah that's a good price about that but maybe that would be a better place eip1 is definitely the most up-to-date um it's like the actually maintained one um however i personally i don't know how other people feel i personally do not have a problem with just ditching eip1 and just updating this instead and so this would be and we could just delete everyone at the end again this is my personal i don't know if everybody agrees me or anyone interviews me on that but having multiple places just seems to add confusion and so just getting you know if you ditch every one and ditch that other tab you've got up there the last

one and this is the only place here yeah what you're talking about yeah i'm proposing like that's a good idea does anyone have a problem with that i guess the first question oh yeah that i think that's brilliant because yeah it eliminates that yeah plus it take plus it doesn't really make sense to have that an eip to have that kind of information in eip but i just thought that was kind of a traditional thing that everyone knew what the ip1 was oh it definitely is there will be people who will be confused by such a change and there may be people who push back on it because uh tradition and status quo is hard to fight against just again just my personal preference

would just be this is the only place that all that information lives i wonder if we should tell you something on eip1 um for example let me pull up the ip1 real quick there is that um you got a link to it under contributing there on that uh over here uh yeah that one under contributing you got first review afp one oh yeah that one oh this one here yeah so to move in that directions maybe we should start out by

making those changes the changes i described over here put the home up here and the icon and and stuff and and and but get started with that and then maybe we could put a proposal up on eip1 that says we're going to move all this information over to here and ask and would anyone mind if if i created a feedback form petition on canonizer where anyone that didn't like that could create a competing camp and say why they didn't like it and and then we could and if and if we had a a certain amount of that would give us an ability so people who did like that

could say yes i like that and people who didn't like it could join a competing camp say they don't want to do that and if we had a lot of feedback then we could abandon the plan to do that would that be a way to move forward or should i not bring canonizer into this or i don't personally have any problem with using canonizer though i have a i'll pose a weak argument that for people who don't have or don't want to create an account on canonizer provide a mechanism for them getting their feedback into it nonetheless like we have the ability to uh to use facebook and github identities so they don't have to create an identity on canonizer they can use their i suspect i suspect there will be people that don't want to share

or don't want to link that information right but at least they would have if they wanted to provide feedback they would yeah that might be a barrier to that but but anyway yeah but they could if they wanted to and they could use their github id and go in there and create a camper or i could help them create we could create a camp to start that so that anyone who wanted to just express i don't like this could just join the camp and and and people who did like the idea we could go the other way but anyway i'll leave it up to you guys if you guys think that would help i'll i would like to do that but well if you guys think would help

um i would like just go ahead yeah i was just saying that like can we do it with the help of just hack md or google doc like that would be easier even to add comments and i'm not sure if many people outside this you know core group who are actually looking into process improvement would be you know uh interested in this kind of change or going and adding feedback there so that's just my fear i don't know okay so so because i've already got this google doc here that's describing a lot of the stuff i'm talking about here but i could clean that up and specifically put a point at the top that mentions that so if anyone and and then i then we could submit a change

to eip1 that points the google doc where the proposal is being made and people could make some feedback in google doc would that be easier um yeah is that right okay okay so yeah my my suggestion here would be like if we can get a list of like what what has to be removed from which document a set of that and what needs to be added or moved to the new document if you can just clearly uh okay those things then we can discuss that one thing that i don't uh i'm not sure if i see in the screen sharing today uh we discussed about is the readme dot md at ethereum slash eip's github repo

are we also considering that because i see that there are some duplicate work there yeah that's in let's see is that yeah open link new tab that's or that yeah that's it that's this one right here this is it this is the reason no that's not vips open link the readme oh this is the oh this is the issues the the yeah the the yeah there's this is what you're talking about here right this is the read me so over here um so i'm sorry what was your question again so are we considering this here as well because you see uh the draft last call accepted these things are

not correct like for accepted yeah yeah yeah yeah and these definitions are there in eip1 so do we want to have it here or not no yeah this would should this information should be duplicated there should be in my opinion there should be one single source of truth and i thought it was going to be um eip1 but it sounds like the place we want to put it is here and so i think we should push towards in my opinion we should push towards this being a single source and then over here and and other people have suggested like greg that the only thing in the md would be information on how to build this

and and this stuff down here about the tools none of this stuff should be in here and so yeah i would think we would want to clean that up and basically put links to if you want to find that information then come over to this page here which is um eips.ethereum.org which is the definition the canonical specification of everything yeah so does that make sense it works for me so so next question then how do do do i is there a pull request or somewhere or how do i start proposing to make changes to this yeah so this is this lives on in the ap's repository

on github so it looks at um feel free to jump in like client if you happen to know where that page is okay i found it so this is the page on github facebook so that page there so that's the page

that's uh you were looking at that so i can do a pull request to this to put where's that link but anyway okay great that's that's what i need to do so this whole site this whole site keep mine this whole site is built by jekyll i believe and so um this is the content for that page there's also this page also has like a footer and a header and if you go up a directory in that repository i believe there's here uh layouts i think or something includes i don't know anyway um you might have to dig a little bit so if you're trying to edit like

the page layout it's different than editing content if you want to edit the content this is how you do it yeah i can overall page layout like headers and footers and stuff you're gonna have to go somewhere else okay so let's see it's in that repo in that folder just i don't know exactly where so copy that here i'll look into that more so okay cool i think i know which direction to push i'll work on that and i'll keep you guys informed before i do anything like do a

pull request i'll i'll possibly do a pull request on my own copy of the repository and point you guys to it if you want to review it before i and and all that kind of stuff so so yeah maybe maybe the first step would be you know just list it out and share that document and uh eventually maybe we can just talk about it in the next meeting or the list and if that is that seems fine to everybody you can go ahead and make full requests for that okay i'll do that target for the next meeting then thanks for all your feedback and help with that and especially puja because she helped me during the week to get caught up on some of this stuff no

problem thanks for you thanks for you to taking care of this this has been there for a while and we have been thinking about it yeah yeah a lot of cleanup needs to be done glad i can help okay so moving on to the next item it's eip status change we have created a pull request for all the eips which are for berlin mostly i think just one um we just left out one to update it and um i believe they have got accepted now they are in review status and we will continue making pull

requests as we come across new proposals which are not in the right uh status query anything else that we want to discuss today from the agenda item uh i think uh edson shared a blog let me quickly get it on the editor's post although i don't see him here to explain it but i'm gonna share the link please bear with me for a moment

see come on so this is about uh becoming become an eip editor ethereum is looking for new eip editors to moderate the eap repo we discussed a few meetings ago about what we are looking into an eip editor or what possibly could be the rules and responsibilities with few discussions uh he has tried to list some of the points that the group agreed upon um i received this blog just last night so if it is fine and no further improvement is required we can go ahead and publish this sharing it for any further feedback if people have

hmm no i i couldn't read it like it was middle of the night and since morning i wasn't meeting so i could not okay i read so many vlogs i lose track of which ones i've read already i'll read it again see if i didn't have any feedback okay so uh the last item i see here is review action items from the previous meeting uh it's i have updated the link as uh shane mentioned that it was pointing towards the older one although he has listed out the action item thank you shane for that confirm with sam at ethereum.org whether

the intention to have is ethereum points to the at one spec or vice versa i don't see james on the call who is working on this part but i will try to get more information with sam and james on it um next item also is with james work out on the content part we'll wait for him to report if there is any progress action uh 25.3 cat hurt is to consider eip information for ethereum.org site so we yes we are having some internal discussion and at present we are looking for upgrading our ethereum cathedral's

website some of the contents are splitting into that and some will be going on the ethereum.org cell i think a little more discussion is needed and hopefully by next week we will have clarity on whether or not to go on that but uh uh coming back to brent's proposal like uh he had some suggestions about ethereum.org eip we were initially planning to put content over there but if that has to be moved then we might have to rethink about how how to proceed with this particular action item i think um cat heard his website would link to wherever that information ends up being right yeah yeah

so i was trying to mention here like initially when we were thinking of sharing some information uh of eips with the ethereum dot org site that was on that particular page uh that brent uh shared in the screen today uh ethereum eips so if we have to move content or do some improvement or change it there we might have to reconsider where we would want to put the content but certainly we can discuss this internally in the ethereum categories meeting the next item is brent to continue the investigation into sources from of eip information apprentice working on

that and i think today we made good progress we have some clarity on what to go where and eventually he would create simple request to do the cleanup thank you for that and last action is cat herders to progress eip status cleanup uh yes we are working on that uh we are trying to reach different authors of for not only for um core proposals but also for ercs and interfaces and trying to create pull requests to change the status to bring it up to the like most suitable one for the moment i think that's all from the agenda item

do people want to discuss anything else uh uh like clients since i got in here those eips you submitted or were lobbying for for changing the size do you intend to let those close i was like the size of the nonce being 64 64-bit instead of 256 bits are those approaching the um i forgot they've all been closed by the bot okay um

i mean i i kind of had i think i have some pr's out for him but i've been waiting for alex berazazi to approve them as he was the author so yeah i think those who are all those i think those have all been closed now okay i'll probably circle back to him and see um it was more something i wanted to do because i knew he was busy but i did need to get like his approval to change the things so i'll take a look at it yeah you might want to just ask him if he can just create prs to make you an author on it and then just ask him to approve them yeah that's much easier than him actually reviewing them all yeah sounds good thanks for letting me know

i mean i still i still disagree with you on the vrs themselves but i felt it was only fair to let you know they've been closed automatically that's very big of you if i'm gonna win a fight i'm gonna win if early damn it not not by default okay um i think i i may have a question for if you know um i don't know if this is appropriate to bring it here it's related to coder meeting but i'm just curious to know about eip248 when are we still proceeding with its uh

standardization process which interests them eip2481 i'll type it in right now this is 866. implemented it is um being implemented so um i think review is the proper status for it there was some disagreements and debate but i believe that's one side caved

and so that debate is over so we are proceeding with the standardization process right like it's like in the review of i think review is appropriate for it at this point it's no one intends on changing it like the authors do not have intent to continue iterating on it but it is not final yet because it's not live okay okay that makes sense yeah that's all from the agenda uh today uh for future meetings i'm wondering like do we want to just uh stick to the eips erp and ap1 or do we want to start

considering some other discussions for the process improvement in general uh sorry what do you mean okay uh like uh so far when we started the cipip group we started discussing about the process that was uh kind of messier maybe not having clarity on the eip1 side or the network upgrade and standardization side so now we have got some clarity on that part i was wondering what kind of issues that we can consider here for uh future meetings like is it okay

to consider something related to any clients a particular you know process part or do we want to keep it separated um i mean as always i am a big fan of keeping the afp repo as narrowly focused as possible because we do not have a huge amount of manpower we are finally caught up on vr so so that is good we are down to 22 and they all are actually active things um but i would be hesitant to expand our scope just because like we don't like our staffing issues are still present as far as yeah maybe make a little more progress

on what we're working on first but yeah yes of course yeah as far as other things to discuss i mean there's i think actually all of the things i want to discuss i got through by default despite my arguments i don't want to win by default i won by people nonetheless by just creating prs against eip1 waiting for like two months for no one to say no to them and then i merge them um so that process has been working for me uh it'd be great if we had more people than just being like my reviewing but you know it does allow us to make progress we have making progress i think yeah that sounds good so maybe if we

want more things in the meeting i will start becoming more aggressive with my proposed changes right so he has something to fight over james i support that hi james me you support me picking fights via pr's [Music] hi james so we were like uh very close to the end of the meeting now that you have joined so uh uh we would quickly want to check with you if you have any thoughts on the agenda items or anything in particular you would want to discuss from the previous meeting on uh

like what we were discussing about what to go on at one of our spec repository sorry for putting you on spot my disconsider is james not talking i was on mute looking reading the reading the thing no i um i'll just go back and watch the rest of

this and apologize for being late it's in some notes also right and pooja is going to record it foreign wasn't there one agenda item that we've skipped because james wasn't here yeah was there something waiting for me uh that was just the number one json rpc network upgrade and eip content the item number one that we are planning to add on f1 or spec repository uh i could give some update on that the json rpc so i haven't talked with thomas about it but i did notice that

oasis has their own repo for it so i'm i don't know if that means anything particularly to them or not so that's something to find out and then that's the biggest update other than the stuff that needs to go in there that hasn't yet so i just just got off of the jason rpc call for the week and it sounds like they uh they think that they that you all want them to put the json rpc spec on ethereum.org and so that was the that's where they're at oh

well it should unless the it's a wiki that other people can get to probably be better to be in a github repo that people could do pr's for and so someone indicated that uh at least the section of ethereum.work that they're planning is on github and can be pr yeah i asked i said exact same question and they said oh yeah you computer against the door oh well i guess we do need to talk to them then that's what i said oh thank you i was i was channeling my hair james yeah yeah

yeah that's all right um is thomas still the best person to ask him to talk about that would you would you say yeah definitely okay oh i'll just message him this week see if maybe i can get a call with him just to download his thoughts because we could get it on the site easy we already talked to somebody being able to do that it just would work better if it existed somewhere else so it didn't look as ethereum owned oh yeah you should definitely talk to him

if if you guys are trying to avoid putting on ethereum.org um because you don't want like ownership in indications then definitely talk because i don't think that's the impression he got okay cool thank you i'm glad i got here then on that i have a question about this eip1474 so how do we see this proposal do we want to proceed with its standardization process um i'm asking because i'm considering this for people i think it's it's it would be valuable to get people attention if we are really considering it for uh so on the one hand i think it's a uh sorry eip1474 is the someone

basically wrote the json rpc spec as an eip it's giant uh on the one hand i think it's a good start to specifying jason rpc on the other hand um i mean the whole reason thomas put together this whole thing was because it's not specific enough and i think we should just make sure that actually i think both the authors of that are part of a message group and so um i would just say let them figure out what they're gonna do and then maybe in a month once they have you know some major makes the progress ask them if they want to just move this to withdrawn or not because that's my gut

as far as peep and eve i would wait on it until there's more clarity on who's going to be doing what and where like if jsonrpc is going to continue going through eip process or it's going to be like a one-time spec thing somewhere else and then eips will update it i don't think there's a lot of clarity on that right now because thomas's group is still so new once there is clarity then it might make more sense to talk to them about people at that point so i was talking to uh get implemented of this proposal and uh the author and they suggested that uh some of the wallets are interested into you know adoption of this so maybe with that if we can arrange a call or

something but of course i'm not considering it right away maybe after a month or so so let's see if we can yeah every everybody definitely wants jason rpc specification to exist and be clear and accurate the only thing that blurry's i suggest delaying at the moment is just because there's uncertainty at this exact moment in time as to who will be doing that and where they'll be doing that i suspect in a month there will be a lot more clarity at which point it'll make a lot more sense to approach the appropriate people because we'll now know who the appropriate people are for example no makes sense thank you for that yeah i was i was looking for some more information on

this thank you for that so yeah uh that's all for today's call the next meeting is on february 24th two weeks from thank you everyone for joining thanks everyone cheers