Bankless 🤝 Daily Gwei Friday Livestream ($ETH LAYER 2 SUMMER)

Transcript

oh [ __ ] what's up anthony hey david how you going oh you know hanging out i'm in a different place right now as we we were literally just talking about where i was not at my own home a second ago and then we decided to to live but now i'm talking about it again but yeah i'm in an airbnb in uh san francisco on my way home yeah we're talking about how like you you're able to like travel all over the country and i'm just locked down in melbourne again in my house yeah yeah i mean as if it's any different when you work in the world of crypto but yeah yeah yeah we're world's in a weird space right now um so i guess i won't see you at bitcoin miami in a week a week yeah no no

i'll tell you all at all yeah i'm sure i'll say all about it on twitter because like there's tons of people going and i mean i was just saying to you i saw that you can't even talk about anything but bitcoin at the conference so i'm like i think there's gonna be a lot of people just hanging around outside the conference just at different places which you know it's pretty cool that's what usually happens with conferences anyway like you go and then you know you do go to the main one but you you also kind of like hang out around it which actually that's the main thing i love about conferences just being able to hang with friends like with online friends in real life but yeah yeah i wouldn't be able to do that for a while there's two people that go to conferences and

people that go to conferences and then people that go to hang out right and uh not the last time the last time we hang out hung out was at east denver uh and east denver is is a very like i was a participatory uh conference but the time before that was east new york and east new york was very much separated between like it was meant for builders it was meant for hackathon people and participants and then there was all the other people who couldn't code who just like were going there because we knew other people other ethereum people were going there uh and so that yeah that was east new york that's where i met uh eric for the first time uh oh wait you weren't there yeah you weren't there you weren't there oh yeah i met eric eric for the first time at hudson for the first time uh and

literally just like this like division between like people who are fiercely typing on their computers like hacking like pres and van loon and all the other people who are just like [ __ ] leaning back in their chairs just like oh it's good to see you guys this is great yeah yeah yeah i always loved that though because like i remember at eight denver there was like three levels or something of devs of developers like doing the hackathon and then it was just everyone else crowding around and it's funny because you have like different groups of people one of the groups that you can pretty easily spot are like the vcs and the investors because they'll huddle together and they'll they'll just wait because they want to you know they want to obviously find their next investment and things like that so and you can kind of like see them moving

around like just looking at projects and then yeah as you said they've got the laid back people just kicking it hanging out um and then they're the hackers but man you're making me nostalgic now i miss it that's for sure i haven't been to a conference since 8th denver dude i haven't been able to go i'm [ __ ] missing that man like if for all the listeners out there if you are ever on the edge of like do i go to this a conference thing or not like go absolutely go like it's it's it's where [ __ ] ethereum culture is like if you want to experience what cryptoculture is you got to go for the conferences speaking of culture and conferences did you you you just woke up so you probably haven't seen the mike dudas tweet okay so mike dude has tweeted out a poll and

he goes what are you going to do in miami next week since we're all going to be there option one bitcoin conference option two ethereum d5 nft option three partying option for all the above ethereum slash d5 nft is coming in at number one at 40.5 percent bitcoin conference is the loser at 8.4 and then partying and all of the above are roughly tied i need to go i was i was trying to find like the actual poll because i voted on it a while ago and took that screenshot but still like the and and like i was planning on going to the conference until i found out that like so many ethereum people are just gonna be hanging out and like if you're if the bitcoin literally the bitcoin rules are

you can't talk about ethereum stuff there's a bitcoin only conference then i guess i'll just go outside then yeah yeah exactly uh yeah man yeah as i said like i've been seeing tons of people say they're going and i i you know i kind of expected that there's a lot of ethereum people going and it's just it's more fun to talk about like i really don't like i don't want to bash bitcoin again here i just like it's more it's just more fun to talk about ethereum and d5 stuff i guess in general and you know i mean that's what we talk about all the time i literally talk about it every day you guys on banquets talk about it all the time so you know it's yeah exactly it never gets it never gets old and it's something always new and fresh and you know you

just mentioned that i just got up i did and i literally have not caught up on what's happened i looked at twitter and like i just saw all the updates i'm like oh my god a lot happened while i was sleeping again do you know what happened with apparently there was some twitter spaces where people were talking about how much money they made from pre-sales did you see that oh i saw some rumor about that but now that's that's still something i'm not not privy to yeah i don't know i think there was something about like uh some some big influences on twitter promoting you know pre-sales they got access to and then you know you know selling them off or whatever but uh regardless of that uh i think well we haven't done this in two weeks so the the price man the price what

happened where did it all go wrong oh my god well two weeks ago what were we doing two weeks ago it was it was like at the office yeah yeah okay so so i have two topics on the agenda for so far today it's the question of have an agenda oh two topics you betrayed me two topics i know this is it's because i know what you want to talk about and you already brought up one of them so give me the benefit of the doubt on the other one the second one is layer two summer yeah yeah the other one like come on come on like i know what we're talking about yeah yeah the first one is uh dead cat bow bounce question mark since you brought it up i guess we have to talk about that cap bounce question mark uh-huh uh man i don't think so like

god you know it's it's funny because we like the people i talk to you know they're on both spectrums right there's like the perma bulls and everything who find it really hard to be bearish in general and i fall into that bucket like this is why i can't trade because i'm just bullish all the time and then you have like the people who are bearish but they're only bearish because they want a better entry from what i've noticed like they want to just buy lower and you know and obviously people who are bullish just want to sell higher so this is this is what's always funny about markets you know you can never really get an unbiased view from people because everyone's got their own agenda everyone's got their own reason for wanting the market to go up and down so you can never get like someone uh

saying oh well i actually think it's going to do this based on this this and this because this makes the most sense it's like well this makes the most sense to me for my bags what you're looking for like something you're looking for this actually is what really the through line is mm-hmm exactly so well yeah i don't know i don't know i don't know like i think everyone kind of got caught off guard by this that it was unexpected by maybe not everyone there were some people who who were calling for like a 3k eth but that was based on like technicals and things like that but then you know once we fell through that we just fell even further and i it's been spoken about a lot lately but i really do think it's the leverage in the system uh there's just so much of

it and people just like gets you have such easy access to it that you have these death spirals because there's never enough spot liquidity to to match this right when there's liquidations and stuff like that so um but yeah man i like just generally i mean there's it's impossible for me to be bearish on anything right now even though the prices keep going down it doesn't matter like well when you think about it like it was like i was really bullish and i mean we were both really bullish during 2019 like the depths of a bear market uh and lots of stuff was happening but the price wasn't moving and when it comes to markets they can kind of have a mind of their own sometimes where both positive and negative news won't do anything to the markets it will just be like a market

store in the market yes so uh yeah so i guess that's where i'm sitting right now but i'm sure you're in like a similar boat here yeah there i mean we could talk about how there was there was generally a just like kind of shitty two weeks in the narrative world mainly on the bitcoin side right like elon musk's being erratic was bad like dogecoins like doggy tokens making the front page news that was bad like there are [ __ ] there's [ __ ] that happened like the mine the actual real news which is the china actually banning bitcoin actually doing it that was bad right so we we had like a series of like one two three four punches in a row right after right after just rocketing up and so we had like no price consolidation we had we didn't

establish the highs and then we got smacked by like really bad news and then bitcoin dumped and pulled the rest of the market down with it and like i think in the grand scheme of things you're totally right there's like when when ether d goes from like 43 that hundred dollars down to seventeen hundred dollars in like seven days and then it rebounds a thousand dollars off of the floor and then take for example we can talk about this hypothetical scenario that it keeps on going over the long term that's just a smooth line like it's it went up really fast and went down really fast but then but then it was a smooth through and through and what you're saying about like there's just not enough not enough liquidity in the market it's just an anomaly of the fact that like the spikes

are so high because of how little liquidity there is and so you round out the spikes because it's noise it's like it's like um it's like an outlier right and just the fact that we dipped down to seventeen hundred dollars for a brief couple hours in time was literally what you were saying you just gotta clear out the [ __ ] leverage bros uh and so liquidity just like disappears and so the price can do anything the price can go to fifty dollars and then it'll just go back to twenty five hundred dollars a second later uh and that's just an anomaly that's not actually something that you should really like it's more of an anomaly than it is real the reason why it's real is because a lot of people did get liquidated and like a 60 drawdown off the top will spook anyone

no matter what like watch watchers 60 of your net worth get deleted it doesn't matter that you just only made it in the last like 45 days like you still got deleted um and so that's that's my analysis yeah yeah i think so and that's why i think like even though obviously long term bullish i still think it's going to take a little bit to kind of like keep going up from here i think i'm going to have to consolidate come to break yeah exactly we're going to we're [Music] level of speed actually i i actually think that eth wasn't going up fast enough to be honest um if if we were you know traditionally when you see a drawdown like this on um you know large market cap assets like

bitcoin or eth you know if we're looking at past cycles you would you would expect to see maybe a 40 drawdown at most we've seen that already right we saw that from i think 2100 to 1300 was about a 40 drop or something like that uh whereas you know but getting a 60 drop on each is is incredibly scary especially when it has such a high market cap these days and it's such a wide and varied holder base um and i know we kind of like bounced off that really quickly but the thing is like think about it forty four hundred to seventeen hundred in a week is crazy like we fell way faster than we we went up um but only like two or three times as fast like we went up pretty fast bro yeah yeah but it's like it was like two

and a half times as fast it was like three weeks three weeks versus one week but you know but the thing is i actually think that eighth so it's hard to say like what's fairly value but i actually think that eight didn't go up fast enough but i think that what ended up happening was that there was a lot of other crap happening right there was as you mentioned the dog tokens there was just a lot of froth in the market generally bitcoin was actually weak for quite a while you can see on the chart that bitcoin was weak for like three months man it was like ranging and it was actually going down it wasn't exactly going back up right down not ranging up yeah yeah exactly and then you know you mentioned all the bad news that came out like the esg narrative the the elon musk stuff all

that sort of stuff that just you know i think that just like basically or like tipped over an already wonky kind of horse so to speak right it was already ready to kind of like you know dump and also bitcoin dominance had gotten slaughtered we went over this two weeks ago how bitcoin dominance got had gotten absolutely slaughtered which means that there was people people kept saying oh when's old season like guys it was alt season yes you're waiting for defy season which is different to old season old season is literally all the scams and like absolute crap pumping and we had that we had that in a very big way it's just that people think that old season is means that their bags are gonna pump no it doesn't mean that at all it means that just really shitty bags are gonna pump but maybe your bags aren't part of

that shitty bag so um yeah but yeah i think that definitely you're right that this is going to spook a lot of people it's definitely going to sprinkle over the institution maybe not all of them but a lot of them the what the institutional investors who are like wow you know this is really volatile but maybe they won't allocate as much money now they'll allocate some they'll be like okay well this this asset class is still extremely risky and extremely volatile let's allocate less than we were going to because of it for now right uh but but yeah man and i actually think that narratives aren't going away for bitcoin we've spoken about this before and just like the the energy use narrative is just such a bad one i think in general for bitcoin and doesn't matter if it's right or wrong it's a narrative that's

very powerful and people just gonna gonna look at that and be like wow bitcoin uses this much energy like this is this is horrible uh whereas with ethereum soon we'll be able to just say well ethereum doesn't use mining that's it they don't have to say anything else it's like doesn't use mining right it uses literally nothing that's the whole point um well actually uses ether which is not nothing but from from nick carter was making this point about how he was talking ironically he was talking about like the chia or chaya network which uses um like proof of hard disks and so you just have like hard disks farm farming where you have all these hard ducks hard disks and they're just writing random data to these hard disks and then deleting them over and over and over again and so like and then the hardware's burn out same

model as the asic uh what what the hell was he saying he was he was talking about how um this network got so large so fast that it actually started to tap into like commodity resources and then he was talking about how like this is why you don't like bake financial products into like general like commodities like corn or something because like society needs corn like we don't we don't want the prices of corn to artificially skyrocket for no [ __ ] reason for this art like for this weird thing and and then he's like then this is why chia makes no sense now but to me i was so confused because then he turned it into a positive about bitcoin and i'm like dude what's the one commodity that all humans need it's energy like what like i know we can create more energy

but we can also create more corn like i didn't i i lost that part of it like that's the one part about the one thing a few things that nick carter have said i was just like i don't get this yeah i don't i don't get the hypocrisy and i think when i was actually thinking about this and i was i was going through a scenario in my head and i was thinking okay if i asked the bitcoiner hey aren't you being you know hypocritical by saying that she is a waste but bitcoin isn't you know wasting kind of electricity here and and kind of like hardware i their reply would be yeah but bitcoin's worth it like 100 i already know what their reply would be right and and you know that's actually a fine stance to take i actually think that's that's that makes

sense but at the same time you really shouldn't be calling out other other kind of like waste because it's subjective it's exactly worth you know as a bitcoin you think that she is useless and you think it's worthless but like there are people who liked you and and and like find it valuable and mine it and want to make money off it um so yeah it's extremely subjective and this is why the debate is never going away because it's it's just a subjective there's no objective answer here there's no good or bad it's what people think is good or bad and what what they feel is is is a benefit or not for the planet so yeah i just i don't know man that that that that narrative has extreme headwinds and you know i know you mentioned nick carter he does a lot to

fight it off and puts out a lot of good work around it but that's not going to matter like most people aren't going to read nicaragua's blog posts like it's as simple as that right he's just like hammering out blog posts after after blog post but like he's doing his best man but like he's not winning like he's he's losing and like the whole uh elon musk michael saylor like mining council thing like we're gonna establish the north american mining councils to like make bitcoin green that's a that's capitulation that's bitcoin is admitting defeat and then they have to tackle this problem head on and then they did it in this extremely ungracefully way where we're gonna like establish the council of american bitcoin miners and so all of you bitcoin miners which isn't opt-in but still like

let's all get the miners all in one spot and have a council like come on guys yeah man what is this yeah it's it definitely looks like fear uh like a little bit of fear where they're like well we know this narrative is really bad and if we don't get on top of it it's really bad for bitcoin and they won't ever say it but they'll think to themselves well you know if you doesn't have these problems soon enough like even though some of them will say ethereum's never going to prove a mistake or it's like it is and once it does like what do you got like after that it's it's like it's pretty bad but um and i'm just so happy that ethereum is moving to proof of stake and it's been a plan for for quite a while now i'm happy it's not just a reactionary

thing i'm happy that it was like very kind of like a setting stone back in the day the ethos selected it from day one and it was the right ethos to go by like this is like every single day i'm just like impressed by like oh like all these people that are like humanity's now debating consensus mechanisms in 2021 and like vitalik was like hey guys i'm gonna like i'm gonna solve this problem six years in advance that you guys don't even understand that's coming yeah yeah vitalik's foresight has has been amazing to see he's like i mean even in the white paper d5 use cases were mentioned like financial use cases it wasn't d5 back then but right financial use like he just had so much foresight and and

just generally i think like the theorem community is very lucky to have him um but yeah uh generally just that that that when you when it comes to a narrative war for people who pay attention to what happens on twitter like just even okay let's let's pivot a little bit for a sec to talk about narrative wars look at what happened with one five five nine right look over the last couple days people are now concerned trolling eip1559 and saying that it was people always sold it as a way to improve gas fees it was never ever sold as that not from when it first got created not from any of us in this ecosystem like not many of the people with a reach i made a point to never ever sell it as something that would reduce gas fees i often noted that it may work too sorry that it should

work to smooth out transaction fees because that is part of its design but i never alluded to it um you know fixing the gas phase and i always said that that was layer two right that was not the eip1559 but now we have people coming along and saying well that that's what it was sold at like are you serious like are you just learning about one five five nine now like who are you listening to it's it's just the narrative war is such a very hard one to win because even if you think you've won it though someone will come along and throw a spanner in it and then everyone will be confused this is what happened when i'll just say it like taylor monahan put out this thread that started this whole thing she confused everyone because now everyone is trying to kind of

get you know latch onto a narrative and latch on to an explanation for it and and now there's kind of like revisions of history happening too people like oh maybe it was about this all along or maybe it wasn't about this and it's like it's just so insane because we had a very cohesive narrative the whole time but then someone can come along and just like screw it all up i think and it also doesn't even matter what the motivations are it's a piece of code we can announce and analyze the code as the code itself right and like to also for what it's worth if we're talking about intent it was intended to just make the ux better and now it's touted as this fee burn mechanism and and if i remember i didn't look into the thread too much because i was like this is dumb i'm not

going to waste my time on this um and so the the reason why i think taylor monahan is going after eip1559 is because she's a contrarian and like everyone likes the ip1559 and and so like people the reason why people like it is because it burns eath and it pumps their bags but that's not why it was actually ever implemented it was the first proposal was framed in uh the context of just making gas an easier thing to use uh i i i i was not the first person to like talk about the the relationship between burning eath and eat scarcity but i uh i think i had like the first article that was really about eip1559 that was directly about that um

and it was really just out of the social layer did did eip turn in ip159 turn into this like bullish fundamental case of ethereum's monetary policy after the fact after eric connor was like this is going to make using gas easier now there's a there's a conspiracy that i have that vitalik because vitalik knew about eip1559 or at least like the original construction of it the original mechanism and then he might have like passed it to eric and be like yo you submit this eip because vitalik smart he's like well this is going to make ether be scarce and so i think vitalik was like eric like you go do this um that's my concern have been talking about this sort of stuff since 2016. and he was never talking about like fee burns or whatever he's talking about

improving the gas mechanism for ethereum interesting um yes yeah so there's papers back in 2016 2017 2018 and 1.59 was put forward in 2019 um but but on your point about people saying uh oh well it's all about the fee burn now okay well okay let's put it this way let's see what the fee bone actually does besides just your vanilla oh it pumps your pumps people's bags the fee burn takes the money that's going to miners right now in terms of fee revenue and distributes it to all fee holders and makes a a a kind of revenue generating or like a value capture token because right now it does not capture the net the value of it of its own network because it is not i mean it can be used as collateral it's staking and all that sort of stuff but it is not

capturing that fee revenue so by you saying that oh you don't like 1.59 because it burns fees and directs value to to eth you're taking the other side and saying you're happy with that eth going to minors who dump it right that's the side you're taking really crazy exactly decreasing the security of ethereum and also causing training stability because when you have more fee revenue than uh than uh i guess like uh block rewards it's been shown in a research paper that this can lead to an instable blockchain or an unstable blockchain right so when i see that i'm just like guys like okay yes it's it's it's good for the for for the value of eight and yes a lot of the industry is is showing it like that but at the end of the day like who are

these people following like are you just following traders who are shilling this so that they can trade ethan like you know pump it higher based on this narrative like i know i've been talking about the fee burn a lot for sure but but i the thing that the thing is is that the fee burn is just like a really easy narrative for people to latch on to like and when i look at people arguing against this i'm like you guys should never work in marketing because you didn't understand how marketing works marketing works by boiling down complex topics into an easy to digest narrative that's that's really the crux of marketing so when you want to market one five five nine you want to get the word out about it what do you start with well you start with the most attractive feature of it like which is an eighth

fee burn then you can talk about the other things that's what i've done i've gotten people to kind of like you know listen to me because of that and then i kind of like each pill them later on the better things about one five five nine uh so to me it's just like a a marketing narrative thing that i i think a lot of people in this industry do not understand um you know marketing is something that i think people look down upon sometimes and they're like oh you're just trying to show your bads it's like everyone's trying to show something like let's just be honest here like everyone is always trying to show something like is is taylor um you know shilling uh just her bags with my crypto of course she is like but that's fine it's her product right like it's it's fine so yeah i mean

maybe without ranting too much there i just think that um the forest for the trees gets missed a lot in this in this industry totally totally and on the note of just like everyone chilling their bags like all content producers all youtubers all podcasters everyone writing an article they're all shilling their bags the reason why people write articles is because they write about something that they believe in that's why bitcoiners have so many bitcoin podcasts that's why that's why ethereum people well we actually could use some more podcasters actually these days um it's mainly you me and a few other people that's about it um but like we're all chilling our backs we're all chilling our backs but the thing is someone is right like someone chilling their bags is right there's all these different people shilling their backs and someone's right uh and so at some

point that's why you have to be like a thesis driven chiller because if you're if you're the schiller who's chilling their bags and you're wrong then you're like an [ __ ] in hindsight not an [ __ ] i wouldn't really call him a nozzle but like oh you're the one that got it wrong like you you were just chilling your fake bags right and if you they are the shiller that got it right you're the person that democratized alpha right like if you're the one that did like good job and so and so like at that point like that's why you kind of it's a responsibility to shield bags if you do believe in them because that's that's your right as a person and i guess like in saying that all shilling is not created equal either right you have a lot of things that are

shield that that are scams or dodgy projects or people have access to like um you know i was just saying before about like pre-sales right where there's no kind of vesting or lock-up on their tokens they show it to their followers and then they just like dump on them right um that that that happens a lot in this industry and i'm not condoning that at all i'm not saying that's a that's a that's a good thing but you know when i shall eat i i sh i'm more sure like um you know the fundamental drivers of like eighth and ethereum and what's happening there and obviously like you know i mean me me and you it's the same thing we're both like a long-term ethereum people we're not just like shilling some bags we've gotten a pre-sale i mean you and i we bought the

producers we we bought eight way lighter than my first price which is like 330 dollars exactly so in 2017 right not not in not not in the 2018-19 bear market like it was not eighty dollars at the bottom of the market it was like 330 and then it pumped to 1400 i'm like yes and then it fell at 80 i'm like [ __ ] yeah exactly so i think yeah a lot of people missed that uh there's there's you know some of the loudest people in this ecosystem and the ones you would call schiller's brought in a lot later so they're not they're not kind of like still like bags they bought in at like pre-sale and things like that but but yeah i mean and shillings like it's got a negative connotation that comes with it at the end of the day it's just

talking about things you're excited about really that's how i view it and yeah okay yes you have a monetary incentive to do so but that's like this whole industry if you're talking about something uh most of the time you have a have an incentive to do so whether that's being monetary or social and it can be both you can have a social incentive to do things like obviously i have a social incentive to talk about ethereum because like that's my whole thing like and the same with you guys at banquets that's your whole thing but you make money from it too because it's part of like like there's no way i'm going to shield ethereum if i don't have like like yes i love ethereum but like i'm going to invest in each like i'm not going to sit on the sidelines and be like oh yeah each can go up

without me it's fine i think it's going to go up into the moon but i'm not going to buy it like what exactly yeah yeah exactly so this just it's it that's just like being a rational investor on being a rational person so yeah when i think about that that's that's kind of like the train of thought i go down and i'm fine with people thinking it's gross and disgusting sometimes where people are shilling things but guys like i don't see that with eth i say that with like the dog coins or like the outright scams like all the really shitty projects i just do not see that with something like eighth where you can say oh it's disgusting schiller's just trying to pump their bags guys if i wanted like if we wanted to show bags and pump bags we wouldn't be pumping like eight to be pumping

something else but we don't want to do that right we're not here for that yeah it's it's it's easier well shilling eath is like long-term games right and the reason why it's a long-term game is because we think it's a long-term asset right so like come back to you know this bankless youtube in like 50 years anthony and david's still filling each like he's still gonna be doing it it's probably um do i think we want to cut a third you know middle break middle middle break everyone thank you for coming to this uh bankless daily grade live stream uh 243 people watching it that's fantastic i just put the daily gray youtube channel in the chat so you should go and give that a follow anthony and i we say we do this every single week but then i rug pull anthony every now and then and go

to a different state and so we do this every friday-ish and so stay tuned to both anthony and mai's twitter account and the bank list twitter account the daily grade twitter account and also bankless youtube and also daily great youtube where anthony does stuff like this every single day and now anthony i think we should turn to the main conversation which is layer 2 summer how do you feel about that i i'm feeling like if we say layer two summer too much people are gonna accuse us over promising something that's what i feel like because i already saw it happen with the arbitrary release today people are complaining and saying oh it's only for developers guys like every single piece of marketing copy said it was only for

development like literally i have not seen anyone say that it was for users so where do these people get this idea from that it was for users and i think it's what to do with the fact that when people hype things up again it goes back to what i was saying about narratives and marketing you always kind of focus on the the really the best thing right the most awesome thing coming and what people focused on was oh arbitrary is going to like be a layer 2 that comes out before optimism right it's going to be like where all these developers can can deploy their stuff to and users will be able to enjoy their cheap and fast transactions that is true but that is not true today and and what's true today is that they need to release a developer main net so that they can actually get

the apps on there this is another thing that i don't get when people kind of say this like okay guys if they released it to the public today what would you go and do there's nothing there there's nothing there like i just i don't get what you expect like oh ethereum but on on arbitrage like no you got to go build it exactly so i just i i don't get that and and i don't get what i have people are thinking that but anyway that's what released today right arbitram and then there's other layer twos that have been rolling that slowly there's other apps and stuff there's later twos live today you can go use them and things like that um but i think layer two summer is something that is not just gonna happen coherently it's not just gonna be one thing that uh you know happens at one

point in time like defy summer did i think it's gonna take a little while still for layer twos to roll out to a point where you can have like you know a critical mass of users on there doing all sorts of you know really cool things um but i think it can't happen eventually it's just that i like i mean i thought i thought i was under promising a lot of things even though like i'm bullish on them but it seems like people still think that we're over promising things and it just it really kind of like irks me because you know i think on twitter it's just different on twitter people because twitter doesn't lend itself to nuance at the end of the day twitter lends itself to what can you fit in 280 characters and how much engagement can you farm and that's fine that's exactly what what

what i do it's what you just what like all of us do like we want to get attention to our long-form stuff and our you know our youtube channels our newsletters whatever but the only way we can do that is by creating these bite-sized narratives that get people to pay attention to us and to follow us and by doing that we remove a lot of the nuance from things so i get that but if you're just taking your your knowledge from twitter only right from one person's tweet then you're you're just not doing enough research into into what's happening because you can't get everything from one tweet even a tweet three is not going to give you everything right so that's my general opinion on layer two summer is that we shouldn't over promise this and we shouldn't say this is gonna be a coherent thing it's gonna eventually

happen where there are critical massive users will move to layer twos and we'll have like uh some fun stuff happening on there but i don't think it's gonna happen like people think it is like where it's just like all of a sudden oh my god everything's pumping way too summer we no i don't think it's going to happen like that so so here's my model for how this goes and maybe maybe adding summer to it is more just like marketing and excitement which i mean we're always excited but layer two season era whatever so here's how i've been explaining this to my friends imagine like disneyland but oh you've probably never been to disneyland have you um disneyland in tokyo so i guess that counts okay so i think an amusement park the disneyland that i'm familiar with in uh in uh anaheim in los angeles it's

like very much you go you go in through the gates and then you go up to this main walt disney statue and then there's like different parks like parked this way a different park that way a different park that way and so you have like this main disneyland area and all these different parks like spawning off of it right and so this is what ethereum is like main park super congested sp lines everywhere because there's only one spot to go the lines are super long and now ethereum as an ecosystem they just launched like the matic park not too long ago the polygon park and now they're about to launch the arbitram park and then they're about to launch the optimism park which are even way more like way more surface area and instead and and when they launch these things there's this massive like

first it's it's kind of like a gold rush but people have to wait for the developers of like these applications to come and build the future rides that people are going to ride on so that the people can come find the gold because the gold's in the ride okay so here so like sushi swap comes and they're going to the unit swap they're going to come deploy on on arbitrom and this is completely my speculation but like in order to get liquidity on to arbitrary perhaps both unit swap and arbitrage i'm just using these as examples so like insert your d5 up here uniswap does uni distribution rewards to people providing liquidity on arbitrary arbitrarum provides rewards for people

using uniswap on arbitrum and so you have these dual yield farming coming from both application which is like the ride and the actual real estate which is arbitrary and we've written like repeat that for every single application borrowing and lending application like ave is going to probably take the lead here because it can move so much faster than compound so ave is going to be yield farming ave tokens on arbitrary which is also going to be giving armor from tokens and then also they're going to repeat this on on optimism right everyone we need to give away the tokens of these l2s because we need them to be decentralized how do you give away tokens we learn this in the first d5 summer we just give them away to people that use the protocols and so there's going to be yield farming on our arbitration there's going to be yield

for harming on our on optimism there's already yield farming on matic right and so it's just going to be [ __ ] yield farm city in like these three different like parks that are brand new and the important thing is there's no [ __ ] fees there's no fees and so that that is like the bold case i'm super [ __ ] excited for this why i'm calling this ultrasound summer and maybe also fall or whatever just ultrasound or not ultrasound layer two winter for those in the southern hemisphere there's not that many um no no i i agree with you and i think you know a big part of these like summers is the is the yield farming and the liquidity mining right and the conditions have to be good for this though you need a bullish market you can't have like a bearish market because

liquidity mining doesn't really work in a bearish market right you need it exactly exactly and we already saw a taste of this on polygon with rv launching with matic token rewards on on polygon there so you could and we saw like i think there's 17 billion dollars in in in ave on polygon right now because of that so yeah as you said like if all these tokens are being given away through liquidity mining programs it's a really easy way and good way to bootstrap liquidity um you know and and i think this is what's going to happen for a lot of these apps and some will move faster than others and things like that and you can't have liquidity mining on like every single l2 so maybe this is a race here where you know who can bring out their l2 or scalability solution you

know first so so to speak so i think from that perspective it makes sense but you know if it depends on what the broader market does as well i think as i said like we're not long-term bearish but like term the market is just like no one knows what's gonna happen in the short term right now in the markets like absolutely no one i think people are betting on it's gonna take a couple months for it to work itself out because we got ourselves into a really bad rut here and every single bounce is gonna be sold down because people are going to be like well i'm going to sell the relief bounce be like oh i should have sold tr and now they're like i bounces they're going to be like i should should sell here and i think a lot of people are

saying well unless eighth breaks 3k we're going to be stacking like the 2k to 3k purgatory for a little while um so if unless that happens um or maybe you know what the funny thing is maybe this all happens at once because these events have a have a really um funny way of like all coalescing around each other so if you think about what's happening in the next couple months say say the market starts hitting it back up in july for example again i think baba trim will be open to users in either kind of like i'm estimating late june or early july here um and what else is happening in july well optimism is also said that they're going to go live with the main net in july 1559 is still happening in in july um as far as i know as i saw something about like a slight

delay on it on twitter before but um i think it's still happening in july right so if we get like a a return of the bull in july well then we can possibly have an l2 somewhere right because the conditions are there for it i think the reason why we had like a d5 summer originally is because the conditions were there for it it was the market was just getting started heading up we just discovered this really cool new primitive fees were were low and then spiked high but people didn't care about the fees because they had made so much money from their eth holdings like people forget that the people who were part of defy summer were early eat investors so at that point in time they didn't care about the fees because they had made a lot of money from from their eighth going up so they

were like well oh i all right doesn't matter like i'm getting all this money from this i don't care about the fees uh and then it was just a new thing as well so as you were saying this is like going to be a zero to low fee kind of environment where it's going to be a new thing for people where they're going to be like the people who were locked out before are going to be like well i can actually do like all this cool yield farming stuff now and there's going to be centralized exchange bridges in and things like that for people to kind of come into it uh so yeah i think the conditions can be there in maybe june like maybe late june kind of like julyish but we're gonna have to see what the broader market does if the broader

market is like super bearish and bitcoins like dumping each dumping i i don't see us having like an l2 kind of like season like because of that yeah yeah to some degree maybe you can you can have like some amount of faith in in markets and say like well because optimism and arbitrage are releasing and this this real estate is going to be so incredibly valuable that that can be its own catalyst and be the reason why we are bullish not that people's bearishness kill the potential for l2 summer or delta whatever it's actually the fact that these things are happening it's what makes it bullish it could go both ways it could go like for some at some point in time catalysts move markets uh it's an extremely viable catalyst uh and as as to what you said

like there's already plans for certain exchanges so just put usdc right on to these l2s and so i've been talking to some of my friends one of my one of my friends owns bonds so that's stupid and so i'm telling him sell all your bonds and just put it into stable coins and yield farm on all these l2s that are coming just like you can keep your dollar principles like i'm not even going to bother to try and convince you to buy eth he did but he doesn't own um but i was like well your bonds are yielding like butt [ __ ] percentages excuse my french on on the bond market go go farm some actual real assets like this is the future go do that like no same same risk kind of um and and so like if you the the time to deploy just

bear cash it's like kind of coming up like pretty damn soon and you don't have to buy each you don't have to put it into risky assets you can keep your principal but in the spirit of going bankless you're gonna get better yields in the bankless world like and so you might as well go do that yeah yeah no totally i totally think so and and this has been my kind of like thesis for a while as to why i don't think we're going to get like a long drawn out bear market anymore and i think we're going to get like mini cycles is because of that as you said like i mean where are you going to put your cash right where you're going to put your usd if not in crypto like are you going to go to a bank account uh no like what are you going to

do within a bank account are you going to go buy bonds no we're going to do bonds planet exactly are you gonna go to the stock market i'm like okay maybe you can go in the stock market but like you're still buying assets you're not holding on to your cash right whereas um and this is this is why i'm saying like with if you keep your cash in stable coins well you're looking for a dip to buy you're not looking to exit crypto you want to buy a dip or you want a yield farm you're keeping the capital within the ecosystem so from that point of view i mean i i think it's very hard to be kind of like bearish like even medium term like i think short term is fine because short term can do whatever they whatever it wants but long term medium long term

like bullish just like everywhere like there's just seriously like i just can't find any reasons to be bearish and think about how many users have still got to come into the ecosystem as well and how many of them are locked out because we don't have um sorry because we have high fees and what that's gonna what that's gonna unlock on l2 is gonna be amazing so yeah i think people might get blindsided by this um you know and then the memes of like oh ethereum can't scale we're just gonna die like and that goes back to what i was saying about narratives and narrative war it's very hard for ethereum to win the ethereum can scale narrative or just based on promises and based on us saying well you know this is coming out soon um we just once we get it out there and people can actually use

it and people see that oh wow this is actually real that's when um you know i think these things start changing i think polygon had a pla played a pretty big part in this as well where you know that they kind of showed this and and kind of like you go on there and yeah i know those debates about polygon being like not a l2 and all this sort of stuff but you know generally it's a it's an ethereum alliance scaling solution and that showed people that you know when ethereum wants to it can it can scale both on the technical level and the social kind of coherence level too right the one thing i don't know about matic is like if the matic network blows up like what kind of assurances do you have that you can come back to ethereum i think that's that's kind of like the the

weakness that matic has is it doesn't have perfect assurances in the same degree that optimism in arbitrary does uh and so like you can't have perfect like security when you are automatic like there is some risk there but at the end of the day if it works it works and right now it's working and so like whatever talk we can talk about compromises for whatever but like if it's offloading scaling fees and reducing fees and like count it as an l2 um you know we're gonna like oh the it's not technically an l2 that's technically incorrect but like people random users of ethereum aren't going to give a [ __ ] like oh they're like oh it's the thing that that things are the things i do are cheaper that's that's the l2 i'll go over there like they don't care what it is uh and so

like to some degree that's probably why people are so bullish on matic now is is not only does it it's already first people already building on it it's got all those like oh any sort of l2 like it's all automatic it's all automatic like i guess that's bullish i don't really know like how architecturally why that works or but okay and so to some degree sure whatever count it as an l2 like so long as it works yeah i think when it comes to these sorts of things it's just the trade-offs right and the polygon uh pos network or the automatic network as you're talking about they have their own validator set like 100 plus people state validators they have slashing all that logic lives on ethereum they checkpoint to ethereum um but the actual central point of failure is the multi-sig uh bridge which

essentially is the bridge from ethereum to matic which holds billions of dollars of assets that is a five of eight multi-stick right now so if you know they wanted to not saying they would five people could collude and steal all the funds in there right and that the thing is that multisig is not there for any malicious reasons it's there because they want to be able to upgrade the platform still uh and because the platform is still very early and they want to um protect user funds in case of any exploits and stuff like that this is not dissimilar to what happens with defy apps when device apps have admin keys and stuff like that and wbtc sure yeah yeah so just that's that's the thing just as long as people understand the trade-offs i think is fine um the the definition war like the narrative

war around defining things is already lost even though that i think technically in l2 like is something that's secured by ethereum directly and doesn't rely on its own kind of security um and you know matic or polygon has been referred to as a as a side chain i i just think that even that kind of term is is useless i think it's all about you know is it like its own network is it secured by itself which which polygons pos chain is okay where's the central point of failure here well it's the bridge right so the bridges really are generally kind of like the central points here um and you know who's you know who's responsible for the bridge like what are their social coherence and i think you know that obviously i mean i should disclaim that i'm an advisor to polygon but i think that you know the

team is is is not like malicious or anything like that he's not trying to harm ethereum or anything they're kind of very aligned there so um and you know even these other like i guess you can call them true l2s like arbitrary and optimism are going to have guard rails on them in some way or another i don't know if they're going to be centralized guard rails or anything like that or kind of admin keys but they're definitely going to have ways to i mean just think about it like if arbitrary optimism want to upgrade their networks once they're live like how they're going to do that without like a a multi-seek where they can actually just like put the upgrades in themselves well they'd have to set up a whole governance process that's not going to work really early on in their life it's going to hamper their adoption

because they're not going to be able to move fast so i think early on in these projects it's fine to have an admin kit it's fine to have a central point of failure as long as you're upfront about it um if you're if you're kind of like trying to hide this fact well i mean if you're trying to hide it then i can see you malicious that's a different story yeah right yeah because you're hiding information from the market market and not allowing them for them to decide for themselves yeah yeah and this is why i had such a big problem with bsc is that cz is marketing bsc as if it's exactly like ethereum right that it's just like a theorem with low fees i was like no man it's like centralized ethereum like stop with this [ __ ] marketing and you know i i think as long as people are

honest about what these systems are and people understand what they are that's that's fine by me i think you know if you're lying to people that's when it gets like kind of kind of gross yeah yeah totally um what should we talk about next um well i mean markets l two one five five nine drama chat i mean chad what should we talk about let's just give us a topic there's lots we could talk about but maybe they've got something they want to hear about yeah yeah i i've always wanted to do like a uh uh just like have you ever used the webinar feature of zoom i guess it's not all that different than uh then uh youtube having a chat function but uh polygon loki cardano killer well you have to be alive to be killed

you know i always viewed polygon as these um not so much cardano but as these kind of like multi uh sorry these interoperability multi-chain protocol things like polka dot and uh what was the other one cosmos yeah yeah so i always viewed polygon as as that's because they're gonna be they're not just building the pos chain they're building like what they call internet of blockchains which is going to be like standalone chains l2s you know all this sort of stuff um hybrids whatever you want to call it uh so yeah that's what i view it as but as you say yeah i mean what's there to kill you know you know what i haven't heard anything about the compound chain when's the last time you heard about something about the compound chain i actually saw robert leshner tweeting about it on twitter like i think two

days ago and saying that arbitrary should have like a star port on the compound chain i'm like okay well what is actually happening with this compound chain like what is it right now apparently there's a new assets in compound link in true usd so they actually added some new assets to base l1 main chain compounds like that's the first thing that's changed about that application and i guess to some degree they're kind of stuck being like the ultra secure application versus ave which is kind of the move fast but you not yet break things fingers crossed uh app and so like i guess if compound does start rolling out the features then it kind of breaks what it's good for which is like a really locked down vault um yeah i mean there's a lot there's lots

of money market protocols now with more coming i mean you have like ones that move really fast like cream and and fuse from from rari capital uh and then you have ones that move you know a bit faster but like not as fast like other and then yeah the ones that don't move very fast like aven uh sorry at like compound and makeup right but that's yeah it's all trade-offs again it's all trade-offs like if you move fast you introduce cairo into the system that may not be safe because of a variety of reasons well you have to take on the risk and the risk gets taken on by the whole protocol even if the markets are separate if you have like say you have like the token gets sold off for insurance then you bear that risk as a token holder you bear that risk as a

protocol whereas if if you're just onboarding like really uh robust collateral that has really robust liquidity and that liquidity has existed for a long time then you know you're fine that's what compound and maker try to do and that's i think compound is even more conservative than maker at this point oh yeah uh i mean i i i'm interested as to how that how that's true how is that true well i mean maker has actually been on boarding assets pretty pretty quickly these days like if you look at like how many assets make as in onboard over the last few months compared to compound i think maker actually wins there um yeah compound just i don't know why but like yeah they do move very very slowly on that front um yeah compared to the others so so here's something i've been thinking about

lately so uh i got into into ethereum around like july of 2017 after ether ran from like 10 or 20 dollars all the way up to i think it was like 425 or something and then it crashed back down to 135 uh and then it rebounded and then it it was uh like just like ranging from 330 to like 270 for like six weeks it literally felt like forever and that was like my first impression of crypto was like ether ranging from 330 to 270 for for like it was like august until like october and then and then that's when it did its massive run all the way up to like fourteen hundred dollars and said it's 2017 i'll all-time

high it feels like that right now like ether ran from 100 all the way up to uh 4 300 dollars fell all the way down to seventeen hundred dollars and now we've been ranging between like two thousand four hundred and two thousand eight hundred for one one week and like what you we were just talking about is like well we could do this really we could just range until like july right when eip159 and optimism comes online and arbitrary allows users oh that's weird like kind of crazy fractal right yeah yes so i've seen this talked about a lot lately um this fractal two to uh 2017 and it's funny because like the magnitude is different here because

i i don't think you can say maybe it ran from like a hundred to forty three hundred because if you're saying it ran from ten dollars to four twenty dollars that happened in six months in 2017. um was ten dollars in january of 2017 uh at the beginning of january right whereas a hundred dollars was only true in march of last year so it took us like you know 15 14 15 months to get to 4 400. so much longer times time frame there so if you really want to do it do a comparison i think you should be comparing it maybe two to kind of like bitcoin here because ethereum is as big as bitcoin was back then because it's about market cap and stuff like that but this is also why i think that when you look at these kind of fractals and look

at these charts it's kind of hard and i don't think it repeats like the same way every time it might rhyme where you know human emotions don't really change and the way humans trade things and fear and greed is is the same but i don't know if you can look at that and say that's exactly what's going to happen i do think the general rule is that when you have like a blow off top like this you either go into like a really long term bear market where it just keeps trending down or the market is generally bullish and you stay like range bound for a little while and then you move back up generally i think that's what is happening right now but at the same time i'm not like totally sure because you know short term is very hard to kind of predict i i didn't think that it

would go to 1700 i thought that heath would you know i was looking at when he was dumping i'm like okay well you know maybe we go to under 3000. that's where i bought some as well i bought some at 2900. um but then uh you know i kept falling i'm like wow okay this is a serious dump now and then it kept going i'm like wow okay starting to feel like you know covered black clothes that black whatever it was in march of 2020 and then it dumped even more i'm like what the hell is happening and then i'm like okay well there must not be much liquidity in the system as i thought there was i thought there was more liquidity than what there was um and then we bounced of course and we got went up to 2900 i'm like okay this is a

classic dead cat bounce right now this is like a classic uh let's all just buy the bottom and then we trend it back down i'm like okay i wasn't surprised by that and now we're just ranging so who knows man like it's just it's so hard to tell but if you're in it for the long term you should be unaffected by this if you didn't invest more money than you can afford to lose if you're not relying on crypto to to live then you're fine i mean i i think yeah as long as you kind of like set yourself up for that and not panic sell into these sorts of things you should be should be fine because what what actually gets people long-term is that they blow themselves up whether that be on leverage or they end up panic selling um and then buying back in at a higher

price really that's what people say holds because in the long term holding like we just look at history holding the matter holding holding wins exactly over the long term holding wins over everything so unless you're a trader and trying to be a trader you can be a trader you can have like a trading stack maybe you want to trade with 10 of your portfolio um but yeah just generally like i think holding wins and you've got like proof of that from like 10 plus years of crypto markets and that is not to say this is investment advice but you just need to look at the the industry and look at what what's happened to people who helped from from early on i think that's that's what happens yeah and and on that note there are some things that you can't learn in crypto you can only experience right and i feel

like that's kind of what i was getting to when i was saying like oh like similar fractals 2017 kind of feels like that like the numbers are are messy like time horizons are different like things are fuzzy but like there is like a gut feeling right uh and you know gut feeling is completely emotional it's just my gut feeling but also like there's like kind of this order of operations things or like bitcoin pumps then ether pumps defy tokens pump then we have this crash like we're what we're yet to see is another because i remember like allocating heavy into tokens and i feel like this is like a first cycler thing to do is this like oh i missed out on the pump better buy tokens because that's how i get my leverage uh and so i bought a bunch of tokens and then

bitcoin ran from like seven thousand to twenty thousand dollars and i just felt pain every step of the way because tokens are actually going down in price just getting just slaughtered by bitcoin and then we had the biggest [ __ ] altcoin mania of all time and that's when ether hit his cap and and so we just went through these cycles right and so it feels like it feels like the second half of the of the bull market right it feels like ether had his first pump bitcoin has its first pump d5 tokens kind of lagged behind but are but still have done extremely well and then we have a bunch of new entrants coming in which a lot of a lot of people that i know that i was trying to tell them to get into crypto are now finally getting into crypto uh and so i kind of

feel it feels like that moment in time where like we have the next second half of the bull market ahead of us yeah yeah i i agree with that i actually put a tweet out saying this exact thing right where it feels more like you know june july 2017 than it does jan 2018 and i do agree with you i just think uh it's just funny whenever you kind of look at the prices and the magnitude of the increase and how each went you know 42x before it crashed in 2017 whereas if you look at like say say you want to compare it to the start of this year to now um you know eighth was like what a thousand dollars at the start of this year i think um so it's only a 4.4 x and that's because it's market cap is much larger

this time around and you know you can look at other coins that did the 42x for example which they did like some other coins did a massive run like that so that's when i see people saying oh you know each is going to go like 40x again because it went 40x in 2017 or whatever it was it's like nah guys like this is not going to happen that's the market caps are way different and it takes a lot more money to move these days that's why you see bitcoin as being like an asset that doesn't go up too much in value but again i mean it doesn't go i mean it grows up but it doesn't go up as fast and again it's just a risk thing like you're it's le it's less risky to be in btc and eight than it is to be in other things

like yes btc and eight i mean eight went down 60 percent but a lot of the other things went down like 80 and that might seem like a small gap but going down 80 is way larger than going down 60 because it's it's it's percentage-wise it's not um not based on on something else so uh and that's just a risk you take and and also on the recovery eth and btc are going to recover probably much faster than all these other things will so um yeah that's that's kind of like how i play it it's like you're playing the risky stuff and it's not just risk based on market stuff it's also risk based on the project like we know that btc and 8 are going to stay around for a while but a lot of these kind of other projects who knows if they're going to be around who

knows if they're going to get traction who knows that they're actually going to be successful and a lot of them haven't been and a lot of them have been slaughtered because of that in addition to the market turning down yep totally um and that that's why i feel like with the way that we should leave uh listeners is that la always always long-term games always always play play position yourself like it's fun to play on leverage i play on leverage you if you play on leverage you have to position yourself in a way where you can still play the game even if you get punched in the face right so like you can you can take the loss but if you're out of the game because you lost too big then you're [ __ ] um you're allowed you're allowed to take an l but

you got to keep yourself in the game uh because this is a long term revolution and so you can't count yourself out of the revolution because honestly you only get it one time right like maybe you miss a 2017 bear mark or a bull market and like that sucks because you only get one 2017 bull market but you have this one so like don't [ __ ] it up don't [ __ ] it up yeah yeah exactly and i guess like even as a broader thing the the kind of revolutions that we we're seeing now within crypto is like a once in a lifetime thing or a once in a generation thing like the last one was the internet they seem to be happening much faster but when the internet was growing like i was a kid man like i couldn't experience this like i couldn't invest in companies

i couldn't do anything like this um so so now i'm not and i think a lot of people are in the same boat a lot of people missed out on the internet because they were just too young they hadn't even been born yet i mean think about it like if you some people born like in in the sorry people were born in the year 2000 that are now like 22 years old 21 years old or whatever so yeah it is crazy but when you think about that it's like okay well those people were literally born into the hype into you know of the dot-com bubble they didn't get to experience that at all they were literally a product of the bubble there's people celebrating and having babies exactly so so from that perspective all those people like get to enjoy this and even like early night i was born 92 so i

mean you were as well and like around yeah exactly so yeah but like for us you know in the year 2000 we were eight years old i wasn't worried about that i was worried about my pokemon games on you know game boy i wasn't worried about the dot-com bubble i didn't even know about the dot-com bubble until i was like in my teens but so from that perspective yeah this is this is why kind of like uh it's a once-in-a-generation thing normally once in a lifetime thing so you make the most of it by playing long-term games and not blowing yourself up on leverage trying to capture some short-term wins totally totally and i will take note that like if we do have defy summer round two or at d5 season round two with l2s that's a blessing because like we already had it once and

like now we kind of know what to expect and so that is also something to take advantage of anthony thank you for coming on the bankless day god wow the bankless daily way friday weekly sometimes weekly live stream here's a daily the daily gray youtube channel i'll put it into chat give anthony and his youtube channel will follow there because he does stuff like this every single day uh i listen to it on the podcast every single day and it's where i get a lot of my information and then we come and talk here and just kind of [ __ ] post and have fun uh and so thank you for tuning in uh and anthony i will see you in a week yep thanks everyone see you later peace hey we hope you enjoyed the video if you did head over to bankless hq right now

to develop your crypto investing skills and learn how to free yourself from banks and gain your financial independence we recommend joining our daily newsletter podcast and community as a bankless premium subscriber to get the most out of your bankless experience you'll get access to our market analysis our alpha leaks and exclusive content and even the bankless token for airdrops raffles and unlocks if you're interested in crypto the bankless community is where you want to be click the link in the description to become a bankless premium subscriber today also don't forget to subscribe to the channel for in-depth interviews with industry leaders ask me anythings and weekly roll ups where we summarize the week in crypto and other fantastic content thanks everyone for watching and