Arbitrum Nitro announced, Klima DAO is coming & more - The Daily Gwei Refuel #228 - Ethereum Updates

Transcript

hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the daily great refuel where recap the latest news in the ethereum ecosystem i'm your host anthony sosano and today's the 12th of october 2021. all right everyone let's get into it so uh just a shout out here to cryptex who are hosting me in a twitter spaces on thursday uh thursday october 14th at 12 am at utc this is friday morning for me so follow aussies on the east coast this will be friday morning uh you can just basically go uh i kind of see the link here we link in the youtube description but i'm gonna be just talking to them uh alongside uh preston van loon is one of the eth uh i think he's just that's actually his wrong twitter account there but that he's one of the easter core developers works for the prolabs team uh

and hunter here as well he's going to be uh who does community at uh at off chain labs uh who built arbitrary of course so yeah uh definitely come you know listen in live on i guess like at this time whatever time that is for you i think for most people it's gonna be the thursday just for australians it's uh it's um a friday morning so thursday probably evening for the u.s and i think europe's going to be asleep during that unfortunately but i'm sure it'll be uh you'll be able to replay it later but yeah definitely go check that out all right so proto lambda from the ethereum foundation he's a researcher at the ethereum foundation put out an update on the merge interrupt test net now i mentioned that there was a test net that was up and running uh that basically was the one that was kind of

like launched uh with all the clients kind of in sync with each other now this update basically goes through that after launching that test net which was named amphora uh that the team realized that they were putting a rough equivalent of three times the main network load onto it due to some config quirks so there's going to be a new test net going live this week so this isn't one of those kind of like long live test notes or anything like that this was just like kept live because it worked so well but they're going to be winding this one down i assume and then kind of like launching another test net with the correct configs in place so if you're interested in i guess kind of like connecting to this test net just you just have to wait until later this week i think until this

spins up and then you'll be able to connect to it with your own kind of like uh like hardware and software there so yeah just a bit of an update on the interoperability uh sorry on the merge front there all right so i think the probably one of the biggest updates from the last 24 hours was arbitrary announcing a major upgrade coming to their network called arbitrim nitro now this in terms of like how major it is it's probably on the on the same kind of like footing as uh the ovm 2.0 that optimism is coming out with that's going live i think in a couple days on test net and going live on a main net a couple weeks after that on october 27th or 28th so uh the trdr of what arbitrary nitro is is basically the next iteration of arbitrary so next iteration of the

software of the arbitrary one network um and it's built on standard technologies like wasm and geth so it's more evm compatible and an order of magnitude faster than uh albertum's current tech and adds another zero um when it's ready they'll be deploying it as a seamless upgrade to arbitrary one now what i found very interesting was that it's more avm compatible um this is exactly what optimism is doing with their upgrade they're basically having evm equivalents so it seems to be a bit of a a fight here not a fight but like a bit of competition here being like you know let's see how you can get to you know the most evm compatible evm equivalent as possible so arbitrary is definitely moving in that direction there which is really cool to see another thing that caught my eye here was them i think they said down here in

terms of like speed improvements uh where is it where is it um i think it was up here somewhere yeah so they they're they're estimating a 20 to 50 x increase in layer to execution speed which i mean if anyone has you if you guys have used arbitrary you'll know how fast it already is like it's pretty much within a second your transaction gets confirmed on there so they're claiming to be able to do it even quicker in terms of execution which is which is amazing of course and they also said that they expect a sizable decrease in costs now i wrote today's daily grade newsletter about this but basically what i'm seeing some people assume is that the current kind of iterations of arbitrary and the optimistic ethereum network are like the final form they're like gen one essentially of what

these layer twos are going to be there's going to be many many iterations coming out there's gonna be many upgrades coming over time these upgrades are gonna primarily be focused on efficiency i believe uh especially around gas costs right bringing those costs down as much as possible but arbitrary optimism they wanted to get their networks live out there just in whatever way they could in a mainnet capacity because they wanted to ensure that people could start using it start building on it and then they can just improve it over time perfect is the enemy of good literally waiting until you think that what you've built is like ready for prime time and uh sorry it is like perfect and ready for kind of like the scales of the world and doesn't need to be upgraded anymore is not the way to go about it when it

comes to software development it's an iterative process and there are projects out there especially in the layer one space that have done this i mean i think cardano is the perfect example here where they worked on smart contracts for like five years they finally delivered it in some capacity i don't even know what capacity they delivered it in um and they and from my understanding they waited that long because they were trying to get uh uh to kind of like as close to perfection as possible but then they release their smart contracts and it doesn't really feel like anything special and they're using like an old outdated model and they feel very very far behind with what they're doing there um they're not the only project there's plenty of them out there so i really do like the approach that a lot of these layer two teams are taking and it's not

just arbitrary optimism starkware's taking the same approach by putting starknet to mainnet but in an alpha fashion so in a very very early kind of like uh mainnet release but by putting it on mainnet they attract developers they attract users and get those early people doing uh kind of like using it and developing on it in order to improve it over time there is literally no point trying to kind of like reach perfection in software development and kind of like not release anything for years on end and then by the time you do release it everyone else is just like why would i use this thing now like these other things here it's it already works like i'm not going to bother with it unless it's like a substantial improvement unless that's you know when it comes to getting people to use new things it has to be a substantial

improvement over the existing thing so for example the reason why a lot of people use these evm side chains is because they offer much cheaper fees right it's the same reason people are using layer twos they offer much cheaper fees than layer one that is a substantial improvement and there's also the uh of course like the farming and the old farming incentives and things like that but a lot of the main draw for for a lot of users is those is those cheaper fees uh especially you know i mean new users who don't want to spend fifty dollars on a unisop trade uh definitely they they definitely um want to use their scalability solutions but just releasing kind of like uh smart contracts or releasing some kind of like a new way to do smart contracts with a new language that's not a big enough

kind of like change to convince developers and users to to use your new thing so i i think this is what a lot of um software not software engineers but in particular researchers get wrong is that they they always try to reach perfection because they're they're you know they're researchers they love being able to kind of like get to the point where they're basically like you know this is the perfect design this is amazing this this is you know this is uh this is going to change the world this is going to be great but imagine if ethereum did that for ethe 2.0 like i went over i went i talked about yesterday how long it has taken eth2 to roll out how long it took to get the proof of stake how long you know it's taken to get to the merge how long it's going to take to get to

sharding can you imagine if ethereum one never launched and we just waited could you imagine if ethereum didn't launch in 2015 and we all just waited until uh everything was ready and proof of stake was ready and that was all live and then we launched kind of like the smart contracts once the proof-of-stake network was done and once charting was done ethereum wouldn't be anywhere in the conversations today it would be just another one of those layer ones that no one really talks about their ghost chains and this is i guess like illustrating my example perfectly here is the fact that ethereum technology as it exists today the evm proof of work all that kind of stuff it's actually really crappy technology from from a technology standpoint but it works it works it has network effects it has tooling it has developers building on it it doesn't

matter if it's crap it works and it's there for people to use um so again like perfection is is the enemy of of good this should not be the goal for a lot of these teams and i'm very very happy that the layer two teams pretty much know this they know this they've taken it on board they're not trying to get to perfection they're you know releasing what they have and then adding upgrades to it over time and these are substantial upgrades as well you know just quoting here 20 to 50 x increase in execution speed and a sizeable decrease in costs in cost even if it even if it's something like a 30 to 40 percent decrease in cost that's a massive improvement for this first iteration and then they're going to keep i guess that's the second technically and then they're going to keep getting

better and better and you know optimism is the same with their ovm 2.0 they're reducing costs as well and they're going to keep reducing costs over time so and this hasn't stopped the adoption either what's ended up happening is that yes the fees are still quite high on these rollups like three or four dollars to do a swap sometimes depending on layer one fees but people are using them they're building on them they're deploying to them and in parallel the arbitrary and optimism developers are making the platform better it's exactly the same thing that happened with ethereum where we've made the platform better over time we've put upgrades into it through ethereum hard forks and now we're at the kind of like cusp of getting the merge done and then getting sharding added in which basically just enhances all of this sort of stuff and

if we had waited all those years to do that and there wasn't any ethereum one network there wasn't any kind of like existing network people to do things on ethereum would be so far behind every other kind of like network that had spun up and there's a few projects out there that are like this and i think this is what a lot of people miss is that they don't understand network effects they don't understand the fact that um switching costs are really really high for these sorts of things they think about how high the switching cost is for someone to go from an iphone to an android phone like i've tried it and i've been an iphone user for quite a while now but the thing is i was an android user for a while too and i think i got my first iphone in like 2013 or

something like that and since then i've been an iphone user and i tried going back to android recently i think a year ago within two days i was back to iphone again like the switching costs are insane like don't no matter how easy they make it for you to migrate it's still you know what you're used to what you like using um is is kind of what you're gonna stick to and android isn't like a hundred times better than the iphone like i mean not even even if you want more customization out of a phone or whatever it's it's not a hundred times better it's just it's not enough to force most people to switch some people will for whatever reason but i mean i think that's just one example of how the switching costs are really high and same goes for like my operating system i use windows on my

main pc i have a macbook because i like the macbook's hardware better than any kind of like windows tablets uh tablets laptops but uh i don't actually like mac os that much i love windows and there is literally no way i'd be able to switch to something else like even linux like some skin on linux it'd be very hard for me to switch to and it'll be basically impossible for most people to switch to because they like windows they're used to windows it's what they love using even if it can be you know annoying sometimes it has its own quirks and things like that same goes for ethereum and whenever like people say to me oh once my favorite l1 has this then it's a game over for ethereum it's like are you guys serious like i i don't understand what goes through these people's heads

like it's it's a surefire way of identifying noobs that's for sure because i feel like newer people think this and i just don't understand the uh the network effects around this which is always odd to me because network fx is one of the kind of things that in technology is basically everything like uh and is the reason why technologies succeed or fail but i get it and i'll obviously i'll keep preaching the fact that um you know they're very important but when it comes to kind of like layer twos and people say oh layouts are gonna have trouble getting adoption just like these other chains are i don't think that's true at all and you know it's not just liquidity mining that can get adoption really quickly for these sorts of things but it's also the fact that uh the layer twos have a community push

behind them like all the ethereum community which counts as part of the network effects they're all pumping up the layer twos and saying you know these are gonna be awesome we should use these signal to developers you know you build build here and i'll use your app on here that counts for a lot i think at the end of the day and on top of that they offer a better user experience too like a much better user experience you go from paying 50 dollar fees to you know even five dollar fees that is a massive improvement over 50 dollars right it's on 100x improvement but it's like a 10x improvement and then once we uh keep getting better and better those fees are going to come down even more and eventually to swap on like unisop on layer 2 it's probably going to cost under uh under a dollar at least

and under 50 cents or even much cheaper than that depending on how this evolves over time that right there is 100 x improvement but then eventually there's going to be users that just never touched layer 1 never experience high fees anyway and they're just going to experience these these low fees on layer two and have a really great time there so maybe a bit of a little rant there but i just i really think that it's important for people to understand that network effect is what technology is all about and ethereum has network effects coming out of everywhere like no matter where you look whether it be on chain whether it be uh the evm itself whether it be solidity whether it be developer tools uh uh kind of like developers building on it users i mean everyone uses ethereum even the people like even the people that are using

other chains maybe more heavily they've still used ethereum before and the funny thing is that the most used chains are all evm chains right now they're all just side chains to do ethereum which bodes very well for arbitrary optimism which the funny thing is arbitrary optimism's fee revenue is higher than all the other l1s there uh the volumes are very high the total value locked is very high arbitrary loan has almost two billion dollars of tbl in there uh right now optimism is growing um steadily over time diy dx is um has a lot of tvl but also has like a lot of trading volumes is rivalling centralized exchanges so i just i i don't know people just like do not see what's coming you guys do you guys tuning in to the refill every day hear

me rant on about this all the time but i think most people just have no idea what's coming with the layer two space and how you know over the next at least next year next year or two how much improvement is coming to this space as well and how much scalability we're going to get absolutely amazing but anyway i'm going to stop the the little rant there and just move on to some of the other layer 2 updates so to no one's surprise or at least not to my surprise um starcraft announced that they have a strategic partnership with nethermind now you guys will remember me talking about never mind how they've built a bunch of tools with for starkwear like the voyager block explorer and the uh solidity to cairo transpiler called warp uh this is just kind of like i guess officiating the the strategic

partnership here which is awesome i mean never mind uh have an ethereum one client that they've built uh a a kind of like core client i'm sure some of you are running that um but it's great to see them kind of like officially teaming up with starkware to build more kind of like ethereum tooling more layer two tooling for for starkwear i mean just that that transpire the solidity to cairo transpiler for developers is really really cool because when stocknet goes live on mainnet there's gonna be a lot of developers that want to get onto starknet right and to do so they have to have their uh code in cairo that it can't be in solidity so uh if they don't want to have to rewrite their contracts in cairo they basically just use this transpiler it's not a as far as i understand it's

not like a one to one thing and it's 100 it's not like they can just take their code run it through this transpile and everything will run perfectly there's going to be a bit of you know tweaks and changes need to be done the tooling will probably need to be replaced but it's much easier than rewriting your contracts so this is incredibly important obviously block explorers are important too but i'm expecting etherscan to come out with a starkware or starknet block explorer very soon anyway especially if starknet's going live in november i would expect it to come at the same time all before so really really cool to see that partnership kind of like officiated here and speaking of starkware uh john on uh john's on twitter tagged me in this post today they uh he found uh that arjun's contracts on on starknet has appeared in

arjun's github uh and you can see this on it's a mirror post here where he's kind of like posted about this so basically arjun is already working on uh starkware uh sorry stark in the integration which makes sense considering that it's going live on mainnet next month so arjun wants to be ready for it uh i'm not sure when the arjun's going to come out with their zk sync uh kind of like implementation i'm going to assume it's going to be this month to be honest i mean there's still what 18 days left of this month maybe it's next month uh but it's very very soon they've been teasing it for quite a while here all right so patrick macquarie put out a really really great tweet uh um i guess like earlier today where he said it's fun to say that rollups are competing with monolithic blockchains

like ios solana cardano etc but the real prize is that roll-ups will compete with custodial exchanges like coinbase kraken bitstamp ftx etc the thing is i actually think that they're competing with everything i actually think that roll-ups are going to eat everything especially zk roll ups um the technology is just too good like as as polynomial has been going on about and i've got polynesia coming up here but as as they've been going on about um it's just such a huge shift and such a huge kind of like scalability boost that uh we're not only going to be able to obsolete these other layer ones in terms of scalability but we're also going to be able to challenge and maybe not obsolete but like challenge and overtake

these kind of like custodial solutions or exchanges or service providers like these exchanges that are listed here as i mentioned before the oi dx is already doing more trading volume than some of these centralized exchanges and they're just one app one exchange one perpetuals exchange and there's just so much more uh kind of like coming here for four roll-ups that uh the the kind of like next five years as i said before is the modular blockchain error and at the heart of that at the very heart of that is roll-ups like without layer two scaling in general without rollups you don't really get a modular blockchain design you're missing a key piece of that because with modular block change you have consensus um kind of like execution and data availability uh it's all well and good

if you have uh consensus and their availability but you if you don't uh and security goes in hand-in-hand with consensus but if you don't have an execution layout being roll-ups or or kind of like um or something else i mean you can do it at layer one but inherently you get less scalability at layer one but if you don't have an execution layer of chain you don't have a modular block chain so roll ups are obviously a key piece there and what bring it all together uh because it's funny you can have data availability or data stored off-chain you don't have to have it on chain and still have a kind of like modular design and you can have consensus and security actually done off chain as well funny enough this is what some of the um the data availability blockchains are doing but you can't have a modular

blockchain without rollups um i just don't i i and and kind of like without uh sorry an off-chain execution engine doesn't have to be a roll-up can be a valydium or evolution but you can't have that kind of design without an off-chain execution engine um so yeah i mean and on that note uh i guess like roll-ups even validiums and volitions they're just gonna eat everything and i was actually talking to a friend today about this and when you really think about it the reason why rollups can do this is because they're off-chain they're not and because they're outsourcing their security and they're kind of like consensus to ethereum layer one um because they're basically saying that i'm going to take this massive load off my shoulder which is consensus and security and data availability it's

going to take these massive loads off my shot i'm not going to worry about that that can be ethereum can worry about that and i'll pay ethereum to worry about that i'll worry about just doing execution um and making the best execution layer possible this is similar to say like a club owner um and they're just like well i don't want to have to worry about security so i'm going to hire security guards i'm going to obviously pay them and then the security guards can worry about it and i can get on with doing all the other stuff like if they're they're a club manager they may you know organize the kind of i guess like uh the the the knights organize the djs organize the kind of like um the alcohol all that sort of stuff so it's kind of like just this division of labor so that each uh kind

of like i guess entity or stakeholder within the system can do what they're good at and that's exactly what's happening with the modular blockchain design where you have uh the security being outsourced data availability also being outsourced or you can keep it in-house if you want to have an off-chain construction um and then of of course you do you know roll-ups just focus on execution which is uh which is why they can offer such cheap transactions they can keep uh kind of like making it more efficient making it more effective over time so it's just really a beautiful design at the end of the day and i'm sure you've all said you've all heard a lot about this not just from me recently but bankless is starting to talk a lot about it polly now keeps publishing a lot of stuff uh bankers actually did a an

episode i think it was um yesterday uh ryan and david went through this kind of thing like the whole monolithic versus modular blockchain stuff they the funny thing is you may get put off by the title it's um ethereum or something like this is why ethereum will go a million x and they're actually talking about ethereum's scalability not eighth going a million x i mean i i wish ethical a million x but it's not happening guys like let's be realistic here um that would mean that the us dollar has kind of like failed but anyway um in that episode they go through kind of like the whole monolithic versus modular so i actually recommend going and listening to that because they run through the whole thing in a structured way uh whereas i know on the refill can can sometimes be kind of like out of out

of out of sync and and the structure can be a bit all over the place because i'm just going through things as they happen so definitely go check that one out there and it wouldn't be a refill without highlighting one of polynomials threads again today's one is about uh basically how um the kind of like current networks and what i was saying before how like the current arbitram um optimism and like zk networks and stuff like that are all just like the first iterations early mvps with many missing features and optimizations and in this thread polynomial basically goes through what kind of improvements are coming obviously like nitro and ovm 2.0 um and then you know stock net they're going to go into alpha but as they progress through they're gonna get better and better uh so yeah i mean this thread

just kind of like reiterates what i was saying before but in probably much much less words than i was kind of rambling about before so definitely go read this if you want a tldr of that um but yeah just another great thread from polynomial there so brantley from the ens team put out this tweet which is funny because like uh he said breaking metamask supports e s websites the d web is here decentralized web is here if you have the metamask extension in your in your browser you can type in a dot eth name and if it has a decentralized website it'll load you must put kind of backslash at the end try it now by entering vitalik.e backslash and watch the magic now the funny thing is when i saw this i did a double take i'm like breaking like this has been a feature for i think

years at this point um uh you know how is this breaking and then in the next tweet brandt is like like well no this has been true this has been true for years also brave and opera natively support it and the ethe.link and ethe.limo gateways lots of ways to access the dweb so yeah for those of you who didn't know if there is a kind of like um a website tied to it like there is a vitalik.e backslash you'll be able to kind of like visit that if you have metamask installed which is just a really cool feature of ans again i think ens is one of the most slipped on things within the ethereum ecosystem i know i talk about it a lot and i've talked about signing with ethereum a lot but it just seems to be something that a lot of people really

underestimate even though it is going to change so much going forward it is going to be a key piece of mass adoption going forward and the ens team just you know is probably one of the best and most kind of like aligned with ethereum that i've come across in terms of uh supporting ethereum's mission and ethos and keeping things decentralized that the dns team they haven't got a token or anything like that either they don't want to do an uh a token or issue a token maybe they will in the future i'm not saying that they won't uh but like they seem to to be kind of like not maybe not against that but they seem to just not see the need for it which is fair enough but maybe if they want to decentralize the governance of ens they may do a token i'm not sure um i'm sure

they've talked about it before as a team but you can never tell here but the golden rule my friends my daily great friends daily great refuel listeners is that everything will have a token except the daily way so maybe uh you know i'm sure some of you already have an ens name i do and if they ever did a token maybe they would air drop it all to dot eat people but uh yeah no promises there it's still cool to see all these features of course uh just give it a try for yourself um maybe right now after you finish listening to the refuel all right last couple of updates to get through so pods finance has been live on uh our polygon for quite a while now the polygon pos chain but today they announced that they're on the ethereum main net now so you can go to

app.pods.finance and to play around with it pods is an options protocol uh so similar to other options protocols that you may have been seeing out there lately like lyra and dopex and this i mean there's a lot of them like premiere there's a few of these options protocols now actually out there but yeah great to see pods kind of like go live on a theater on ethereum mainnet in addition to i guess the polygon post chain that they've been live on for a while now uh as sphagnum as prime says here when albatrom optimism and starknet i'm sure that's coming the great thing about everything being compatible is that these devs can basically just like deploy their stuff to these other networks without having to change much which makes their lives much much easier and i think we're going to see you know just pretty much every app go

quad-unquote multi-chain and it won't just be like the these evm side chains it'll be a lot of these layer twos as well which is really really encouraging all right final thing to talk about is klima dao which is a project that i'm actually really really excited about so disclosure here i don't hold any of these tokens but i actually plan to buy them once they go live next week so it's the clinton dao is launching on the polygon main net next monday the 18th of october at 8pm utc so you can check out the announcement posts for full details but essentially what klima dow is they call themselves an algorithmic carbon-backed currency they're trying to fight climate change by using the olympus dow style model so our olympus finance limits dow the the om model uh

if you've seen how on works before uh before maybe uh you don't need me to explain it to you but the tl dr is that basically it it's kind of like a rebasing uh coin where it rebases over time and it kind of like collects uh value into its treasury and does protocol controlled value where there's basically i think there's like 600 million dollars in the the olympus dow treasury or sorry the olympus olympus dow treasury um that kind of like backstops the whole system and then people can like stake their tokens then every time it rebases you obviously if you're staking you get the you know the portion of the rebase and then it kind of like goes up over time a lot of people have accused olympus dow being a ponzi i don't know like it it's funny because in crypto the line between ponzi and

legit project is so blurry because of all these token uh kind of like schemes that go on and these in these tokenomic designs i don't have an opinion on that to be honest i do hold some om tokens just as a disclaimer there but i think that what climberdail wants to do is they want to kind of harvest this speculative degeneracy for lack of a better term and use it for something good and that something good is basically fighting climate change um so i mean i'm not going to go through the details of how it all works you can definitely just visit their medium page for kind of like what they're trying to do here but essentially from my understanding they're going to use the money to buy carbon credits and back the whole thing with carbon credits which is basically a way to offset kind of like

carbon emissions which i think is just really cool like as an ethereum i actually am on the kind of like side of caring deeply about the environment and wanting to do something to fight climate change it's one of the major reasons why i'm so excited about the merge getting off proof of work i don't care what peop what proof of work proponents say about it encouraging clean energy or being good for the environment i actually don't buy into those arguments at all um to be honest like from all the researchers that i've seen i just i'm not convinced at all by it and you know that's a debate that is probably going to be uh going on for a very very long time but that's just my personal view on it um so anything that can help fight climate change is amazing in my books

and i would really really love to to get involved with that's exactly why i'm gonna be getting involved with climbing here it's you know obviously uh kind of like i you know there's a chance to make money from this as well i'm not kind of like hiding that i'm sure pretty much most people buying this is doing it because they want to make money from it but that's the whole point the whole point is just to harvest that speculative kind of like fervor around something and use it for good which is exactly what platforms like um like bitcoin do as well right and other kind of like uh public goods stuff like when um the core researchers and core developers sell nfts like when trent van epp sell the bunch sold the beacon book nft and a bunch of nfts around that and the eip1559 nft that was all kind of

just harvesting people's need or want to buy nfts to speculate on them and then donate the proceeds to core developers and researchers so we're already doing this and you know there's been many many attempts and many many other ways of doing this where dow's donate to get coin and stuff like that uh and i love just seeing more of this happen and i i want to see more of it happen in kind of like the off chain world not just within the ethereum kind of like ecosystem but also doing stuff like fighting climate change maybe helping um you know people out of poverty donating to different charities because there's so much money sloshing around in this ecosystem so much speculative money that so much degenerate money too that if we can harvest this for good it offsets the kind of like bad that comes with it

offsets the scams it offsets all the rug pulls to an extent it doesn't totally offset them because a lot of scams and rug pulls but it definitely helps and kind of like restores balance a little bit there so that's why i'm excited about projects like this so definitely go check it out learn more about it again disclaimer i plan to buy clean mine i own some om tokens as well um but because i like the model i like how it all works and of course i like making money too so i'm not going to hide that right i didn't didn't just buy this thinking oh yes i'm going to buy this knowing that i'm going to lose money on it so i'll be fine if that happens no obviously like i i i invested in this for you know financial gain as much as i

have for social gain and i think that's totally fine at the end of the day you shouldn't be shouldn't feel bad for doing something for financial gain um you know even if sorry you shouldn't be bad for doing something um that is it will give you social gain but like you think is going to give you financial gain as well it could they can work both hand in hand and they can work very nicely too like it doesn't have to be pure degeneracy it can be uh you know you can take the kind of like speculation with the funding of public goods or doing something good with the money um so yeah i think that's really really important to consider as well but anyway i think i'm gonna end it there for today so thank you everyone for listening and watching be sure to subscribe to the channel if you haven't

yet give the video a thumbs up subscribe to the newsletter join the discord channel and i'll catch you all tomorrow thanks everyone