Allo Protocol V2: Funding what Matters with Nate Gosselin & Zachary Fleischmann

Transcript

[Music] welcome to the green pill. network podcast if you're just joining us we are building a coordination a network Society of thousands of hackers dreamers and doers focused on using crypto to bring positive sum digital systems to the world this podcast features the people who are doing it and it's published every Tuesday and Thursday actually this episode's coming out on a Friday because I've been rescheduling a couple of guests this week but generally Tuesdays and Thursdays if you want to learn more visit our website at Green pill. Network where you can download the green pill book for free join the Discord or become a member of your local green pill. Network chapter my guests today are n Nate Goslin who is product and workstream lead for Alo protocol at gitcoin Zachary fleshman who is

engineering and workstream Lead at alop protocol at gitcoin we are talking about Alo protocol which is the Smart contracts behind getcoin grants that can run quadratic funding but now lov2 is is on the cusp of launching and Alo V2 is going to enable a bunch of different Capital allocation strategies quadratic funding is just the first so on this episode we talk about alo2 that launch we talk about the components of Alo V2 we talk about what you can do with alo2 basically put the power of getcoin Grants or any Capital allocation mechanism into your D app and we talk about why that's powerful the vision for the world that Nate and Zach have with

respect to app Capital allocation and allo protocol helping more money to move to funding what matters in your own communities and so this was a fun episode for me because I just really like to geek out on mechanism design and where Capital allocation mechanisms are going to have an impact on the world but it's also the fruition of six years of work at gitcoin decentralizing gitcoin trying to create more impact and to actually have it in a protocol that people can copy and put gcoin grants into their own app is a huge milestone for me as an entrepreneur so I'm playing host in this episode but I do have a lot of domain knowledge about getcoin just from the six years that I've I've been the founder of getcoin and um you know in this episode I'm playing host but uh

it's really just kind of a conversation between us three about Capital allocation and aloe protocol so um a disclaimer before we get into the episode I am a founder of gitcoin I hold GTC I hold eth and um getcoin grants is used to grow the ethereum ecosystems so we're kind of in the heart of what gitcoin has been doing in the ecosystem and I do do a couple episodes about gitcoin here and there because it's what I know about and it's the impactful community that I'm most familiar with but just want you all to have that disclaimer before we get into the episode so let's geek out on Capital allocation mechanisms with Nate and Zach without further Ado let's get into it enjoy Valley Dow is an open Global Collective working to finance and

democratize the governance of synthetic biology Technologies to protect the future of our planet research and progress into synthetic biology is critically constrained by the world of nation state regulations and bureaucracy from middlemen but the potential that synthetic biology has for the world is massive it can produce a world in total harmony with nature we can grow stuff using cells like software it's awesome and the best part is we no longer have to pull carbon out of the ground to grow and maintain civilization don't you think we should be funding this Valley Dow does and that's what they're here to do to try and make the solar Punk World of Tomorrow a reality today so join Valley Dow right now and save the planet at Valley dow. bio hey Zach hey Nate hey how you going chilling really excited to

have you here to talk about aloe protocol what is aloe protocol and what can people do with it so Alo protocol is the community resource allocation protocol uh that gcoin has been building um over the last I guess year and a half so what we've seen running our uh grants programs is that we're seeing these sort of like modern communities uh come together and start to like have resources and a lot of that's been driven by kind of the rise of tokenization Technology we now have all these really cool channels for modern communities to accumulate and pool Capital with what they've had a really hard time doing with it is like then taking that capital and making decisions about how to use it how to use it to

advance their their interests and their needs and invest in their their shared spaces uh and that's the problem that that Al's really aimed at solving some of the insights that I think we glean from like working with communities in the past is that um you know it's it's hard to sort of make these decisions across like a large community like you may it you know there's a lot of bike shedding you may not need everyone to weigh in on a given decision um there's just a lot that sort of goes into that so like the core Insight of of Alo is that it allows you to delegate specific funds or decisions into pools where you can put a pot of funds set rules that are specific to that pot of funds and then let them be um allocated by the people that are like most local to that

decision so um in Broad strr we we look at as a way to just like kind of free the flow of capital but to really enable these these modern communities to start investing in themselves yeah the core goal is literally just to like try and unlock treasuries I think we uh we've all been involved in in multiple Dows across the last couple of of years as Dows have been been a thing and one thing that has been really hard across all the Dows that I've been involved in is how do we actually spend the money that we've raised or how do we uh actually um invest our treasury into things that are going to grow us as an organization and and move us closer to uh our our mission or whatever our goals are to accomplish and and the worst case

this can be um really debilitating for dowas that you end up just everything devolves into a flame war in the governance forum and nothing can get done because uh every financial decision every Capital allocation decision feels unsafe and feels really really threatening and there's a couple common uh problems that we see across across these Dows one of the first of which is that like every decision is treated equally and so this can be a $5,000 Grant to do some merch or run a hackathon or it can be a $1 million proposal to fund uh and budget a team to go and I don't know accomplish some some big thing that's related to our mission maybe build a product or something

without we're trying to like literally break up the treasury by Capital allocation style decisions right not just size size I think is a common one right and so you shouldn't be using the same framework or the same decision-making process for $5,000 hackathon and a 1 million doll product budget who should be making those decisions is also like another Vector that we can look at and so who should be weighing in on these decisions is very is very different right someone who maybe has a background in marketing should be making the decisions around like what hackathons do we invest in or where do we where what conferences do we go to and what is our merch budget for those versus somebody with a background in in product and you know strategy go to market should be making decisions

around what a product budget is something like that we can start to break those kinds of decisions up too from the treasury I think that uh it might be useful to have a tangible example of I think you noted that a $5,000 hackathon is different from a million doll proposal what kind of capital allocation mechanisms do you think will exist on aloe and what what exists now and what what will exist in the future and and how do those sort of fit the the spectrum that you painted from 5,000 up to a million so the existing Integrations on aloe are all related to quadratic funding um there's two key ones that I want to highlight the first of which is Grand stack which is getcoins product suite for running a

quadratic funding crant program they actually just recently rolled out direct Grant as well I forgot about that um so that's a that's a new mechanism way of Distributing capital and allow other is endowment which is also doing qf uh basically when you donate same idea when you donate to a nonprofit on endowment you're also voting quote in a qf round and how matching pool should get distributed alo1 was very focused on qf but Alo generally is really useful Beyond qf and so there's a lot of things that we're really excited about exploring as we kind of approach the launch of al2 which is coming up here in in a couple of weeks when I think about if we stick to what we might call public goods funding right which I know is a

core part of uh of this podcast and thing that you talk about on this podcast there's a couple of other interesting mechanisms that I think are going to be really exciting to explore quadratic funding is very powerful it gives you a great Market signal for for a signal for how the market values a particular thing but if you're working with something that's like a lumpy public good as in like I need $50,000 to do this thing it's like well with quadratic funding who knows how much you get right what you're going to get is a signal of what the how the market values what you're doing not how much you need uh and so an alternative there is something like a dominance dominant Assurance contract which is a fancy way of saying like a fancy crowd fund right so look like that I think would be an

amazing thing to explore we would love to explore on L2 that's totally different from qf it's not even related to qf at all right and and also like this is a little bit skoric but to kind of like pull in some of the things that are I think people know today that we see as being like really core use cases of of aloe um one is like rfps like say you're a community and you want someone to build a specific product for you you may be able to get your community to agree like yes we want to build this product but you don't want to ask your entire Community to weigh in on like who should be building it for you so what you could do is like delegate that decision to a pool and say there's an

expert committee of people that we are entrusting to make this decision and they have the budget within their their pool um they can receive applications and then only those folks um are able to sort of say like yes you can take these funds but rather than being a a multi Sig which may need to exist in perpetuity it's like a single a single use case um pool that you can use to make those decisions so rfps are one um we're also really excited about like contests like if you look at things like hackathons or just General like more fun contests um being able to say like hey there's this prize pool we're going to distribute it using quadratic voting or some simple voting and people can see in code like yes these are the tiers um so whoever comes

in first will get this much money whoever comes in second will get this much money um and you can just put that into a pool and use that to run your content so to to add on to Zach we like on the public goods funding side of things like quadratic funding dominant insurance contracts we think there's some really exciting spaces um I think some of the other use cases that were were really Punk for are things like contest things like rfps um we're getting ready to work on something called micro grants um which just makes it easier to kind of fund like small um community- based proposals so you know 5K or less kind of thing um and that's something that we're we're planning to release uh before the end of the year feels like we're in this place where now that because we we've got crypto and

we've got the internet of Finance um we can move from a place where one person or a small Committee of decision makers makes Capital allocation decisions to a future of Finance where Capital allocation is massively multiplayer like MMO CA Capital allocation and Alo is kind of designed for that world things like quadratic funding quadratic voting Assurance contracts micro grants I'm sure there's a bunch of other mechanisms out there that are only possible uh when everyone's online and you can sort of distribute the decision- making to the edges is the opportunity space here I think it's a great way to put it yeah it's it's a way to sort of like push the decisions to the the most local person the most local group right now you've

got quadratic funding in Alo protocol so anyone can take the power of getcoin Grants and put it into their D app without having to do any of the hard lessons that getcoins gone through over the last four years but in the future you'll sort of have like a strategy Library where people can take these aloe strategies and put them into their D apps and it'll be more than just quadratic funding in the future is is that right yeah not even in the future right right now um so alo2 which is wrapping up audit right now and is being deployed to main Nets later this uh later this month um has a strategy library of about 15 different strategies that the team has put together um which mix and match a lot of different sort of

components so there's a couple of different flavors of quadratic voting with like different eligibility criteria couple of different flavors of quadratic funding um there's different ways of like streaming funds we've integrated with um a couple of other like payment protocols or streaming protocols to do that um so there there's already sort of a a thought starter space of of contracts that people can use can like put in today and then we're excited to sort of see what the the community comes up with over time I I think Zach me mentioned this earlier but we've set up Alo such that like you can run a pool with whatever kind of contract you want so we're maintaining a list of like vetted approved strategies just makes it easier for people to not have to they don't have the expertise to do the

diligence but if you've been thinking deeply about mechanisms like it's really easy for you to spin up your own contract and run your own pool um most of these contracts are somewhere in the order of like two to 300 lines of code um our initial batch of 15 I think we wrote In Like A two or three week Sprint so they're like relatively quick contracts to create but then you just have a lot of flexibility in terms of like how you want to tweak the the the mechanism to work so let's get into Alo V2 I know that yall have just completely Rewritten the libraries what does V2 unlock how does V2 differ from V1 and uh when V2 when can I play with it so V2 is on test NES right now uh and I'm sure the show notes will include a link to

the repository and uh strategy library that Nate was just describing we're going to the audit uh we're in kind of like the tail end of the audit and so we're wrapping up remediation and and dealing with a couple of final escalations from the Auditors and and all that and so we're expecting to launch On mayet by the end of the month or the beginning of of November the next month um and so it'll be coming up uh it'll be coming up really soon we made this pivot from V1 to V2 earlier this year about five months ago I think is when we decided to we made the call to do that we were working you know B1 was uh buil kind of tail end of last year beginning of this year uh we didn't do like a really big launch for V1 because

it was primarily focused on supporting the grant stack use case the goal was to build a like generalized you know a capital allocation protocol like we were describing at the start here um but we wanted to get out quickly test test things in the market Etc and then come back when we had uh lessons from people you know talking to people about it to then do something that was that was really going to achieve that goal and so that's what we've kind of done here with with V2 the start of the summer we took everything we learned from you know operating three or four rounds on Alo V1 through the Grand stack as well as working with a couple of other integration Partners who built on top of V1 we took all that and we built it into V2 and it led to a much simpler much

cleaner architecture there's a couple of pieces to Alo V2 the main piece is aloe itself which is where all the pools are created and managed pool is just a source of funding right that you want to distribute in some way using any mechanism that you want the pool is managed by what we call an allocation strategy which is a two to 300 line of solidity contract uh that determines who's eligible to receive from that pool who's eligible to be like a grantee or or sort of a grantee equivalent from that pool who's eligible to allocate that pool and then how funds are distributed from that pool when you're writing the allocation strategy that's actually that's kind of it every use

case uh that we have thought of every use case that we've discussed with other partners fits with those three uh those three things like who's eligible to receive who's eligible to allocate then how do you want to actually do the distribution right um You have a ton of flexibility in how you how you implement those things and so it leads to like a lot of room for creativity in terms of uh what you want to build there there's a final piece that I'll just mention briefly here before we're Hing it back which is the project registry um this is a registry of profiles representing anybody Distributing Capital through Alo or anybody receiving Capital through Alo and so on the grand stack use case right if you are creating a program to run qf rounds right you're going to create a

profile in the project registry then all the capital allocation all the distribution that you do is tied to that profile on the other side If you're receiving funding from a pool as a grantee or some other use case right all of that's going to be tied to your profile uh this means that over time we're going to be able to build up a really rich data set of project you know project identities basically you name it as like an identity problem but for projects instead of individuals which goes into like just how on you know our key goal of what we're trying to accomplish here is have everything be really auditable we'll be able to very clearly see like how funds are flowing through the protocol regardless of what mechanism you're using which is going to be really exciting and for the audience um there's some links in the show notes

that you can check out allow. gitcoin doco which has sort of an overview of the Alo project docs. allow. gitcoin doco and then there's some links in GitHub where you can browse the code so um the place to dive in would be the links that are in the show notes so I'm wondering uh what the next few months looks like for the aloe team I think that you said that the contracts are in audit now they're going to be released in the next couple months um if I'm a developer out there and I'm looking for a project to build around the holidays or uh looking to build something in Q4 do you have a suggested list of builds do you have things that are going to be going on in the next quarter that people should dive in on yeah yeah it's a great a great question so I think in terms of

the the stuff that's going to be coming out immediately um so exactly as you said um V2 is going to main net uh end of this month I think probably the first uh app that will run on that is impact stream um which is a cool project that's running a a quadratic funding round in Togo it's it's mobile optimize it's designed for kind of like mobile um connections we're really excited about that project but that's going to be I think probably the first thing to run on B2 um so that's out our team as soon as we push live are also going to be working on that micr grants um piece I mentioned before we have a proposal up in the gitcoin um Community forum for running our gitcoin community proposals

or gcps through that the idea with micr grants is basically if you put a cap on sort of like the size of the grants um you can create like a lower threshold for um approval so if you think about it is like it's it's opting for like safe to try versus majority rule so rather than needing like your entire Community to approve a $2,000 Grand or $3,000 Grant you can just get two or three stewards to say Yes um and that will unlock the Grant and enable you to do that so that's something that we are um hoping to test with gcps um this coming season uh so that's something that we're we're going to be working on beyond that we have a uh a list of like Community build ideas that we've um been Gathering

uh on our team right now it lives in a Google doc but I want to publish that um probably on the Alo site sometime here soon um and there's a ton of stuff that were that's in there that we're really excited about I think some of the things that personally like I'm really pumped about I would love to see um an RFP products I think a lot of dows are relying on um rfps or requests for proposals to build specific projects where like a small committee is has the power to like approve a different project I think a simple UI for that would do really really well also like looking at QV I think um especially in a world of like hackathons and just general contests like QV is such a powerful tool and it's also one that we have a couple of um QB strategies

already out of the box that are really easy to run entirely on Shan um which I think enables uh communities to have that entire uh kind of end to end flow audited we've been looking just wanted to interrupt they started interrupt you I just wanted to for the audience say that QV stands for quadratic voting uh for people who don't live and Brea read this stuff dayto day quadratic voting yeah um quadratic voting yeah it's it's something that I I am super excited about it's a a close partner to quadratic funding where quadratic funding you're expressing your opinion by donating to a project quadratic voting if you're eligible you have a certain number of credits or tokens that you can use to buy votes so your first

vote costs one credit your second vote costs four credits your third vote costs nine credits and so on and so forth so it's a way to really kind of like tap and get single from the masses in terms of like what's most important um without letting kind of whales um override the the overarching decision so it's it's one that I'm super excited about I think it has applications for a lot of different decision-making I think you can apply QV to pretty much anything whether it's use it for rfps like we were describing before where committees can vote using a quadratic voting method I think you can use it for contests I think there's just like a ton that you can do with that specific specific mechanism I think some of the other use cases that we want to start seeing are

like Dow budgeting um where rather than uh kind of individually approving um every different uh like workstreams budget like what we do in gitcoin you could have the overall Community like approve a seasonal budget for the Dow so this is the total and then you could allocate that budget to work streams um based on the quadratic Vote or some other mechanism that you wanted to use crowdfunding is another one that we're we're super pumped about um just enabling people to deposit funds and make purchase decisions or um use those funds in some like pre-approved way prescribed way let me throw out two more uh that because all of those are ones that I'm also excited about and then

I'll throw out two more and then we can we can shift the conversation elsewhere I think um the the one that I'll throw out is what I'm calling wrapped voting and this is a new idea for Alo uh and a new idea for for crypto the idea is like when we when we have a protocol we want to incentivize people to perform some some action right the way that we do that is often through staking right you stake you earn some yields that like you lock your tokens up into something and then over time those tokens are worth more right that's one mechanism for doing this that's that's really common with aloe what what I would love to see and something that I would love to explore is this idea of wrapped voting where instead of the reward being built into the protocol you

stake or whatever uh it happens almost like an airdrop right so we're trying to get people to go and mint these nfts okay let's wrap that mid method in an Capital allocation within aloe so someone calls the function in aloe is called allocate someone calls allocate that calls mint on these nfts uh and then we're going to distribute a matching pool using qf or something like that and so you you know if we go with this nft example you get a bunch of artists together and create a bunch of nfts and you say okay there's this matching pool you can not only get paid for uh whatever the mint fee is if there is one for your nft but there's this matching pool whoever whoever gets the

most mint that we're going to distribute it using effectively qf right so go go forth and and get people to M your nft you're wrapped it's called wrapped voting because you're taking some existing method in a protocol or on a smart contractor or whatever and you're wrapping it with a capital allocation decision or or a vote in how Capital should be located you can have that be as forward for your users as you want you can you can so you can like be you present that to them as as what it is or or abstract that away in whatever your product is something like that I think is going to be a really cool use case for alum this is effectively what endowment did where like you donate on endowment and you're actually voting in a qf round um I would love to see a lot

more protocols pick that up as a like incentive mechanism basically for participating in the protocol or in that Community that's one a slightly tangential related somewhat um similar use case would be something like advertising and so you know if you think about that nft example it's like who puts up the matching pool well if it's a brand or if it's somebody who's trying to reach a particular audience what you've effectively done is got qf or whatever mechanism uh for advertising and so you know green pill wants to um promote the podcast you know promote this podcast and so it puts up a matching pool the matching pool goes to whoever drives the most number of myths everybody gets their own nft uh which is

their green pill nft whoever gets it minted the most is going to get the largest distribution from that matching pool you've effectively got a new form of onchain advertising that's like that's much better incentives much more democratic right you're opening yourself up as a community and is Advertiser and someone advertising to actually power law those are two more that I'll out there those are a little bit more like hairbrained or like out there the ones that the ones that n was describing are much more feasible so probably where people will start but uh those are what I'll throw out there one last one before we move on because I think it kind of brings it back to public goods I think with sort of like the rise of defi we've

seen a lot of opportunities for pools to be earning fees especially through like yield protocols or things like that one other use case that we're super pumped about is like and if you're getting this Revenue stream from uh like a pool or like a yield protocol can split off a percentage of that into um aloe pools uh so we've been toy with this idea of an an aqueduct that just basically will programmatically create new Alo pools for you so you could see it where like as you're just sort of earning yield on whatever you staked you're able to like easily funnel that into like always on like microgrants or always on qf pools um so you can almost start to see these like groups putting together yield protocols for good is and we're super

something it's nice to hear you all dream big for a few minutes about what's possible with this Tech feels like we're in this interesting place where getcoins known for quadratic funding and we've sort of realized that quadratic funding is great but it's like if you take a Unix philosophy style of view on the world there's going to be a bunch of different Capital allocation mechanisms and each of them can do one thing and do them well we're not going to have like one Capital allocation mechanism for the whole world and so we're kind of moving to this place where there'll be Swiss army knife of capital allocation mechanisms in the future and getcoin having momentum with quadratic funding maybe provides a lot of legitimacy and credibility to explore that design space but we're kind of at this place where

we're like diving into the deep end of or maybe several different deep ends of a bunch of different mechanisms and we're not really sure which ones are going to be the the big hits but there will probably be multiple Capital allocation mechanisms that are complimentary to each other in the future and Alo hopefully makes it easier to go from zero to one on on any of them because you'll have audited code bases that have a Lindy effect um from others that that have done it it I sort of casting the right Vision here and is that how you think about it exactly we we mentioned like kind of quadratic earlier as like a family of mechanisms and like I think Zach said this like that's very good at identifying broad Market signal you know seeing like what is sort of like the the will of the

masses um but you may not always need that type of signal to make a decision you may want like opinion you may want um qualified opinion like I think what's really exciting about this is like I think we're going to start to see like this uh language and like dichotomy of um different mechanisms that are designed to sort of optimize for a specific signal whether that's like Mass approval whether that's experts whether that's something else um and then be able to apply those to to different use cases and to your point aaki like what's really exciting about aloe is that by creating this like simplified interface um you're able to tap into a lot of like the core competencies to to make this happen it's also like a much simpler sort of space to to interact with and

you has have all that like auditability um of what's happening because this is all happening on aloe regardless of what mechanism you're using you're able to sort of like evaluate it next to each other one other link we we can put in this show notes I'll send over to you is um we have our our first version of our SDK as well um which will make it easier for people to build apps on top of it yeah I think where you just described aaki as like what we see as the next level in this game right qf has been really successful gitcoin has been really successful with qf it's kind of like proven that there is within crypto potentially and starting to see now outside of crypto um a market for experimenting with these different ways of allocating Capital that are really

Democratic that are kind of like only really possible on chain Etc if you think of qf both if you're listening to this and you work at gitcoin or you Rec contribut at gin coin or if you're listening to this and you don't right the thing that I think is cool about quadratic funding in gitcoin is that's kind of like the beach head right the beach Head Market or or whatever um we've proven that this is valuable and that it is functional and that uh you can get a lot out of it but sort of the next layer here is like okay how can we start to do what we've done with qf for all the other like economic mechanisms that are out there that are currently just uh experiment maybe maybe there have been experiments in economic research papers but otherwise not not a ton right so I mentioned dominance

insurance contracts I think two or three times now it's like that's one that I see as really complimentary to um qf that like someone should go and run with um we proven qf it's like qf has its limitations and and those limitations are actually like strengths of assurance contracts dominant Assurance contract specifically right and so there's the opportunity to go and pursue those uh just like n said if you're doing it on aloe the zero to one there is really quick writing a dominant insurance contract smart contract on aloe is probably like a two-day maybe a three-day feat of developer time right you can do that really quickly you can build a front end for it you can start to test that out in the market and then as that grows you get the benefit of all

of this is happening on aloe right this is the infrastructure that we're going to need in order to start to play at this next level as gitcoin but also as a broader community of people who care about public goods funding right all this is Happ on Alo we can start to compare programs um against each other regardless of the mechanism and so we can compare the efficacy of a qf rals with the efficacy of a DIC or something like that yeah it feels like getcoin sort of entering this Niche where there's these big brain mechanism designers of which Glenn W and vitalic buan and Zoe hitzig wrote the qf paper kind of think of of them as like the OG big brains and getcoins kind of taking it to Market and seeing if it actually works in the real world and seems like

mostly yes but there's some things around the edges around Cil inclusion resistance and where there's there's things to work out but there's a real symbiotic relationship between the big brain mechanism designers and the actual empirical data that comes out of running these experiments and we're going to enter this iterative Loop there's like dialogue between practitioners and mechanism designers and so I'm just really interested to see that flywheel Spin and and hopefully the externality of that is more funding of what matters amongst these communities but so there's a place to the table for both mechanism designers here and it feels like people who run web apps one one thing that I I've shared a couple of times in the past that I'll share here is like I think the real value of solidity as a programming language is being a a domain

specific language or DSL for economics right and like what we can do because we can program money as if it were data or like we used to program data uh we can actually take all these economic experiments that are otherwise really hard to play around with and run like prototype right we can prototype what it looks like to have you know dacs as one example but blending protocols is another right like building the infrastructure to doing Alan on web 2 is really hard it's like a lot of paperwork it's a lot of work a lot of accounting that has to go into that but you can build a blending protocol in 200 lines of solidity right so it's a huge huge huge efficiency when we're talking about

like these mechanisms so many of them are just ideal as in economic research papers and until previously there was no tool to actually like really run meaningful experiments and or if you could run an experiment to like do something with that what does it actually start to look like take an you know if we think about like a cool mechanism that exists like qf it exists in economic research and then maybe there's like some lab experiments that you can run with it but how do we get to a point where the government is Distributing its taxes like tax revenue using qf right that's a huge gap to follow and the way to do that is iteratively but like previously there wasn't a way to actually do those

iterative cycles and now there is well we're getting to the back the back nine of the episode uh the back back nine minutes um and so um maybe I'll start asking some some wrap-up questions if Alo is massively successful let's say in the year 2030 what is the world look like how has the world changed because aloe is massively successful I think I always come back to just like the the community decision-making so I I think like right now like our reference point is Dows and those feel like things that are like challenging or out of scope but when I look at sort of like traditional um traditional Tech or tradition small business Tech like they're things like

stripe Atlas where it's really easy for anyone to like create a legal entity and like start business I think in a world where it's maximally successful I think it's really easy for anyone one from like a channel on YouTube or a collection of writers on substack or a community like a neighborhood is able to sort of like hit a button and like have a community that then they can easily use aloe to distribute where it's just like embedded in their day-to-day life where they don't need to be thinking about like what is my token balance or like what is this different element but you can just like hit a button pull funds and be able to start like saying oh like we all agree that we should be

spending this on our um our community garden or we all think that we should be spending this on like building a new product for our our community so in my world I feel like it just lowers the the barrier of Entry um for Community Building like right now in order for it to make sense like you need to have a lot of funds to to do something but if you look at sort of like today's version of Entrepreneurship it you can start a really small solopreneur business um without a lot of Headroom I think if Alo is maximumly successful we're going to start seeing that in terms of like Community organization where it's really easy to create those like 30 person communities 100 person communities um and be able to bring your like Capital to Bear yeah yeah I think like the

maximally successful future here is that money moves right like it's it's liquid it's able to move around and and find the um fill the container in which it's in but also uh you know navigate to the place where it needs to where it needs to go money moves quite slowly right and it moves on one hand as you know faster than it ever has but there's still like a lot of this is especially true in web 2 but it's still true in web 3 there's a lot of barriers to the the movement of money crypto has given us all these incredible tools to bring Capital together to do Capital formation we like just finished and and are dusting ourselves off still from this crazy nft Market that happened but it's like that is one tool for just like

bringing a lot of capital together the thing that we're still missing though is how do we redistribute that how much of the money that was raised in the last cycle is just sitting in a treasury or a multi- somewhere my my bet is probably like 80% of it and I would include in that any any anybody who just like ran off with their communities fund and and some of the nft scams that happened right it's like we want to avoid that too the thing we want is if we're going to pull money together as a community we want to be able to allocate it as the goal isn't to like come together as a community and then look at how much money we've got sitting in our NOS is safe is to actually put it into stuff uh and so the massively successful uh future of aloe is that we can actually

do that we have the tools to do that and once we have the tools to do that we can start to measure the eff efficacy of those tools we can start to put it U start to have the conversations that we really want to have which is how do we make good decisions right now we can't make any and so now you know once we've got these tools in place we can start to evaluate them and talk about how we can actually invest in the things that we want to invest in have that be a good process right so that's what I see as the as the future of Alo here all right money moves I like that as a meme I is there anything I didn't ask that yall want to say maybe we'll go to you first Nate I think the thing that I would call

out is just sort of like how to get involved in and how to start uh building on top of Alo like like Zach said like in the show show notes we're gonna have a link to our SDK and the um and where Alo is live on testnets you can start building and playing with that today um also we uh will be live on on maintenance by the end of the month um I'm not sure when this is going to air but hopefully not too long after you hear this in your uh in your podcast app of choice um and also like hit us up on on Twitter we're at alop protocol we're we're really excited to help people start building um new apps on top of Alo uh and it's something we're going to be spending a lot of our our winner doing so if you have an idea and you want some

help like hit us up we're happy to uh to collaborate with you and and figure out how to make it work riffing off of what you said mov like if the rally and cry for the early internet was information wants to be free I think the rally and cry for for crypto is like money wants to move like money wants to be liquid that's why we have a peer-to-peer payment Network right that's why we're trying to make that massively multiplayer with aloe um we think about why we're doing this it's so that stagnant money isn't isn't good for anybody we want the money to move we want it to be liquid I would honestly just reiterate everything that Nate said was like we want to build cool stuff with you if you're listening to this and you have an idea for something cool to build if you are looking for like a a

deeper dive into aloe and and how it works I think the docs are a great place to start and then we'd love to explore um some build ideas with you I what we're working on here is really exciting there's a lot of of really exciting opportunities potential here and we're really excited to explore the Mind space with people who are have maybe some particular uh subject matter expertise or or experience in a particular community and and want to like bring aloe to um to kind of like the spaces that they operate in uh I think I think that would be really cool all right so as we're wrapping up the episode I'll just note for The Listener that we have put some links in the show notes to allow. gitcoin doco docs. allow. gin.

and then a couple of different GitHub resources and then also twitter.com allo protocol Nate Zack anywhere else the the audience should go to check out more about aloe no they go to the spots yeah that's it yeah okay well thanks for joining me good luck on the launch and we'll see you on the internet [Music] thanks you just heard from Nate and Zach about aloe protocol I am excited about them because I think that the future of crypto means allocating these billion dollar Treasures IES that have been

raised over the last couple years and I think that crypto is one of the most high velocity substrates for impact to happen and in order for impact to happen we have to allocate to the projects that are having the most impact so Alo protocol just feels really Square in the middle of the uh the future of funding the future of crowdfunding the future of impact in web 3 so thank you very much for listening to the green pill. network podcast again we are building a podcast that features the members of a community that are building a coordination a network Society of thousands of hackers dreamers and doers focused on using crypto to bring positive sum digital systems to the world people like Nate and Zach from Alo protocol and getcoin if you value our work please remember to

subscribe rate and review it really helps people in the YouTube or Apple iTunes Community or whatever Community you get your podcast in it helps them find the green pill podcast which helps us grow the movement which helps us build more positive some digital systems in the world so as you're closing down the podcast for today please remember to subscribe rate and review and I will see you next time peace and love